Future Learning Design Podcast

• Moving Beyond Binaries in Learning, Loving, and Living - A Conversation with Andrea Hiott

  I've been so looking forward to sharing this conversation as it is an area that I am particularly passionate about. I feel very strongly that the way we think and talk about learning, teaching and education is so rooted in Behaviorism and Cognitivism and the dominant language of training and metaphors of the brain as a computer. And there is a still a widespread lack of awareness of the emerging insights of cognitive science - often called 4E cognitive science, referring to embodied, embedded, extended and enactive cognition. This is the idea that our understanding, thinking and learning in the world happen in our relationships with each other, our environments, the tools we use, and our bodies, not just as abstract representations in our brains.And there is no-one better to be talking about this with than Andrea Hiott who among other fantastic work, is the host of the Love and Philosophy channel and substack.All of her life, Andrea says, she has been motivated towards the same goal: "Finding ways for us to move beyond either/or mindsets, and to explore our multiplicity."Andrea is a philosopher, cognitive scientist and writer and is currently a researcher at numerous universities, she is also the author of various books, including Thinking Small and her latest book ‘Holding Paradox: the navigational approach to mind and consciousness’ is out in 2026.Andrea's website: https://www.andreahiott.net/Andrea's Love and Philosophy channel: https://lovephilosophy.substack.com/Andrea's community philosophy Substack called Waymaking: https://communityphilosophy.substack.com/Just released: Andrea's latest paper on 'Radical Embodied Relation at any Scale, from Remembering to Navigating' - https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11245-025-10256-7Useful paper on 'What is 4E Cognitive Science?' by Cameron Alexander: https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11097-025-10055-w

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• Outgrowing Modernity - A Conversation with Vanessa Machado de Oliveira Andreotti, Giovanna de Oliveira Andreotti and Manda Scott

  To mark the moment and celebrate the release of Vanessa Machado de Oliveira Andreotti's new book 'Outgrowing Modernity: Navigating Complexity, Complicity, and Collapse with Accountability and Compassion', we are so happy to be able to bring you this fantastic episode!It is the sequel to Vanessa's 'Hospicing Modernity', which was published in 2021 and in 4 short years has become one of the most important books of the century. This new book is arguably even better, and Krista Tippett, the award-winning journalist, author, and public intellectual has called it "a moral, intellectual, and spiritual masterpiece." But one of the best things about it is that it is a workbook, full of guidance for the strength, endurance and flexibility training that we need to be doing ourselves and in our communities and organisations to meet the moment we are deeply in. It is not a work that can simply be ingested for its truth-telling, as you will very much hear from Vanessa in the conversation. The book was released, yesterday Tuesday 12 August, so be sure to order your copy soon!In collaboration with Manda Scott and her wonderful Accidental Gods channel, we are so happy to be able to share this fantastic conversation between Vanessa, her daughter Giovanna de Oliveira Andreotti, myself and Manda.Vanessa de Oliveira Andreotti is the Dean of the Faculty of Education at the University of Victoria. She is a former Canada Research Chair in Race, Inequalities and Global Change and a former David Lam Chair in Critical Multicultural Education. Vanessa has worked extensively across sectors internationally in areas of education related to global justice, global citizenship, critical literacies, Indigenous knowledge systems and the climate and nature emergency. Vanessa is the author of Hospicing Modernity: Facing humanity’s wrongs and the implications for social activism, one of the founders of the Gesturing Towards Decolonial Futures Arts/Research Collective and one of the designers of the course Facing Human Wrongs: Climate Complexity and Relational Accountability, available at UVic through Continuing Studies. Giovanna de Oliveira Andreotti is a Dancer/dance teacher, GTDF member, certified Warm Data Lab host, R4Rs founder, and online course facilitator/co-ordinator. Giovanna has been involuntarily steeped in depth-education from birth (courtesy of her mother, Vanessa Andreotti). Giovanna holds a Bachelor's in Psychology from UBC, postgraduate certifications in Climate Psychology and Embodied Social Justice, and currently coordinates an inquiry that maps pedagogical practices addressing complexity, complicity, collapse, and accountability.If you have more questions about Aiden Cinnamon Tea and the meta-relational approach to AI that we discuss, check out these FAQs: https://burnoutfromhumans.net/anticipated-questionsAnd the Speculative Inquiry into Meta-Relational AI can be found here: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1KFJIVY9slGTcpWBwoMYQwbeKLfV3rNHo/view?usp=sharingAnd further inquiries can be found here: https://metarelational.ai/projects-and-prototypesLinks:https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/783178/outgrowing-modernity-by-vanessa-machado-de-oliveira/https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/675703/hospicing-modernity-by-vanessa-machado-de-oliveira/https://decolonialfutures.net/https://burnoutfromhumans.net/https://r4rs.org/

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• Outgrowing Modernity: A Conversation with Vanessa Machado de Oliveira Andreotti, Giovanna de Oliveira Andreotti and Manda Scott

  To mark the moment and celebrate the release of Vanessa Machado de Oliveira Andreotti's new book 'Outgrowing Modernity: Navigating Complexity, Complicity, and Collapse with Accountability and Compassion', we are so happy to be able to bring you this fantastic episode!It is the sequel to Vanessa's 'Hospicing Modernity', which was published in 2021 and in four short years has become one of the most important books of the century.This new book is arguably even better, and Krista Tippett, the award-winning journalist, author, and public intellectual has called it "a moral, intellectual, and spiritual masterpiece."But one of the best things about it is that it is a workbook, full of guidance for the strength, endurance and flexibility training that we need to be doing ourselves and in our communities, schools and organisations to meet the moment we are deeply in. It is not a work that can simply be ingested for its truth-telling, as you will very much hear from Vanessa in the conversation.The book comes out on Tuesday 12th August, so get online today and get your pre-order copy if you haven't already. And on Wednesday 13th 6am CET, the full episode will be released. In collaboration with Manda Scott and her wonderful Accidental Gods channel, we are so happy to be able to share this fantastic conversation between Vanessa, her daughter Giovanna de Oliveira Andreotti, myself and Manda.Subscribe to the channel to get the episode as you wake up on Wednesday morning! Links:https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/783178/outgrowing-modernity-by-vanessa-machado-de-oliveira/https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/675703/hospicing-modernity-by-vanessa-machado-de-oliveira/https://decolonialfutures.net/https://r4rs.org/Manda's brilliant podcast, Accidental Gods: https://accidentalgods.life/

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• Reimagining Development - A Conversation with Dr Uma Pradhan and Dr Peter Sutoris

  What it means to be an educated person or have an educated population as a country is a big part of what informs the decisions around industrial, economic and education policy. But built into these questions are some fundamental assumptions about what it means to make progress or be developed as a society. And beneath that particular values about what it means to know and be in the world.My guests this week have been exploring these precise questions in the context of international development but as you will hear there are so many resonances with the conversations that we are sharing about change in education.  Dr. Uma Pradhan and Dr. Peter Sutoris are the authors of the new book 'Reimagining Development: Bold Directions Towards a Thriving World'.Uma is an Associate Professor at IOE, UCL's Faculty of Education and Society, and Deputy Programme Leader for BA Education, Culture, and Society. She also serves as Inclusion Co-Lead for the Department of Education, Practice and Society (EPS). At UCL, she is part of the Centre for Education and International Development (CEID) and the Centre for the Study of South Asia and the Indian Ocean World. Before joining UCL, she was a Lecturer and Leverhulme Early Career Fellow at the University of Oxford. She is author and co-author of many books including, Language Education, Politics and Technology in South Asia; Anthropological Perspectives on Education in Nepal: Educational Transformations and New Avenues of Learning; Rethinking Education in the Context of Post-Pandemic South Asia; Simultaneous Identities: Language, Education and the Nepali Nation.Peter is Associate Professor in Climate and Development in the School of Earth and Environment at Leeds University in the UK. His work bridges anthropology with education, development studies and environmental studies.Prior to this new book with Uma, Peter authored two books, Visions of Development (Oxford University Press, 2016), Educating for the Anthropocene (The MIT Press, 2022), all tackling the central questions about how humanity might be able to imagine its path to survival through the unfolding environmental multi-crisis.Links:The book: https://www.hurstpublishers.com/book/development-reimagined/ https://profiles.ucl.ac.uk/87070-uma-pradhan/about⁠https://www.petersutoris.com/https://environment.leeds.ac.uk/see

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• Sparking Curiosity and an Ethic of Care Across Continents - A Conversation with Ramji Raghavan

  As I explore different aspects of the education transition that we need globally, and is emerging, it is increasingly clear that schools (or what might replacement them) won't be the only thing required. There is a huge amount of possibility and power in a broader ecosystem of organisations and networks taking different roles in enabling a more creative, meaning-rich, relational educational experience for young people and for communities. This week it is a huge privilege to be able to share the story of one such organisation that has been quietly getting on with incredible and impactful work doing precisely this for the last few decades at an absolutely massive scale across India. Ramji Raghavan is Founder Chairman of Agastya International Foundation. Ramji leads the world's largest hands-on Mobile Education Program for economically disadvantaged children and teachers. In 1998, Ramji left his commercial career in banking and finance to create Agastya International Foundation, to provide science education to over 25 million underprivileged children and 250,000 government school teachers across India. During his tenure, Agastya has pioneered many educational innovations at scale, including mobile science labs, lab-on-a-bike and peer-to-peer learning via mega science fairs for underprivileged children. Agastya's 172-acre campus creativity lab houses over fifteen experiential science, art and innovation centers, including the Ramanujan Math Park. With support from the government of Andhra Pradesh, Ramji and his colleagues established a 172-acre campus creativity lab near Bangalore. In 2010 the Government of Karnataka signed a MoU with Agastya International Foundation to establish an ecosystem for hands-on science education in the state. Wisdom of Agastya, an illustrated book authored by Vasant Nayak and Shay Taylor of the MurthyNayak Foundation in Baltimore, USA, chronicles Ramji and his team's journey between 1999 and 2014 in building Agastya International Foundation.In 2021 Agastya announced the creation of Navam Innovation Foundation in partnership with the Pravaha Foundation of Hyderabad.Ramji was a member of the Prime Minister’s National Knowledge Commission (Working Group on attracting children to Science and Math), is a member of the board of Vigyan Prasar, New Delhi, the Karnataka State Innovation Council and Executive Council member of the Visvesvaraya Industrial and Technological Museum. In 2009, he was elected a Senior Fellow by Ashoka and in 2011 he was conferred the People’s Hero Award by the Confederation of Indian Industry (CII) (Southern Zone).https://www.agastya.org/https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ramji_Raghavan@AgastyaOrg on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/c/AgastyaOrgThe book: 'The Moving of Mountains: The Remarkable Story of the Agastya International Foundation' by Adhirath Sethi (LID Publications): https://adhirathsethi.com/the-moving-of-mountainsDavid Penburg's article about his time at Agastya, The Owl That Flies Silently: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1bEeVpAE8J8LS5JAQJYxtrYEEVX2G6Ju7/view?usp=sharing

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