Drowned in Sound

GIRLI joins the Drowned in Sound Podcast to discuss her powerful new single 'Slap on the Wrist, which is a collaboration with recent podcast guest Eliza Hatch of Cheer Up Luv, built on real anonymous survivor testimonies filmed in real locations.

We also discuss the new Youth Music report "Just The Way It Is?" exposing the scale of unsafe conditions, unfair pay, and discrimination facing young people in the music industry. The stats are stark: 72% of young music industry workers have felt unsafe. 90% have been paid unfairly. 75% have considered giving up entirely.

GIRLI speaks with total honesty about being signed to a major label as a teenager, being sent to LA alone at 18 with no safeguarding, and being dropped by phone call at 21 with zero support. She talks about why the music industry still hasn't had its Me Too moment and what she'd do with £500 million to fix it, as well as why the silence of the biggest artists is the loudest statement of all.

⚠️ Content note: This episode contains discussion of sexual harassment, assault, and industry exploitation. 

Links:
🎵 GIRLI — "Slap on the Wrist" https://girli.bfan.link/sotw

📄 Youth Music — "Just the Way It Is?" report https://www.youthmusic.org.uk/community/resource-hub/just-way-it-report

📄 Youth Music — Resources to promote safety and rights in music https://www.youthmusic.org.uk/resources/community/resource-hub/resources-promote-safety-and-rights-music-industries

📞 Rape Crisis England & Wales — 24/7 Support Line: 0808 500 2222 https://rapecrisis.org.uk

📞 WeAreMusic have compiled various campaigns and resources to help if you're dealing with harassment or abuse https://wearemusic.info/ 

💛 Cheer Up Luv https://www.cheerupluv.com

✊ Right to Be (GIRLI donated pre-save proceeds) https://righttobe.org

📰 DiS — "Why We Need to Talk About Speaking Out" (Nina Creswell feature) https://www.drownedinsound.org/why-we-need-to-talk-about-speaking-out/

🎧 DiS Podcast — Eliza Hatch / Cheer Up Luv episode https://www.drownedinsound.org/misogyny-in-music-the-numbers/ 

🏛️ CIISA — Creative Industries Independent Standards Authority https://ciisa.org.uk

🎤 Musicians' Union https://themu.org

🎤 Featured Artists Coalition https://www.featuredartistscoalition.com

💚 Help Musicians / Music Minds Matter https://www.helpmusicians.org.uk

🎵 "Believe Women" companion playlist + Qobuz free trial https://www.drownedinsound.org/playlists

📰 Subscribe to the DiS Newsletter https://www.drownedinsound.org/newsletter

Credits:
Hosted, engineered, edited, researched, and produced by Sean Adams
Recorded at The Shure Experience Centre, London
Guest: GIRLI (Milly Toomey) accompanied by Heather Swaine (Youth Music)

The Drowned in Sound Podcast is presented in partnership with Qobuz — the ethical music streaming platform for music enthusiasts. Start your free trial at drownedinsound.org/playlists

For 25 years our publication and podcast has recommended music. We now also spark conversations and create resources to help music fans discover their collective power.

Mentioned in this episode:
Cheer Up Luv / Eliza Hatch · Youth Music · Musicians' Union · Music Guardians · Rape Crisis England & Wales · CIISA (Creative Industries Independent Standards Authority) · Featured Artists Coalition · Help Musicians / Music Minds Matter · Kate Nash · Gazelle Twin · Sinéad O'Connor · MIA · Amy Winehouse · Lily Allen · Laura Mary Carter (Blood Red Shoes) · The Anchoress / 2% in Rising · Nina Creswell / Good Law Project · Patsy Stevenson · Raye · Right to Be

"My brothers are 20 and they're always like 'we are so cooked.' And I'm just like no we're not. There's hope but you just gotta believe, you gotta believe in something."

That quote accidentally captures Music Declares Emergency's strategic shift from awareness to action. After five years of "No Music On A Dead Planet" the Hope Over Fear campaign is building action hubs in grassroots venues - real physical spaces where fans, artists, and local communities organize around the climate crisis.

In this episode, PVA front-person and MDE Campaigns Manager Ella Harris explains how the campaign works, why music fandom is inherently empathetic practice that translates to organizing power, and how she balances making escapist art (PVA's intimate new album No More Like This) with building climate infrastructure.

The conversation tackles touring economics (trains cost £150, flights are just £30), why even festival headliners need day jobs, artists' fear of speaking out, and what £500 million in carbon offset funds could actually fix if redirected toward infrastructure.

This is about hope over fear. Real-life organizing over digital despair. Infrastructure over individual guilt.

This podcast is brought to you in partnership with Qobuz, the ethical music streaming platform. Visit drownedinsound.org/playlists to discover new music in Hi-Res lossless quality and start your 30-day free trial at qobuz.com/dis. 

Edited by: 

Josh Craggs at Dubble Audio

Chapters

00:00 – Introduction: No music on a dead planet

02:10 – Wearing multiple hats: PVA and Music Declares Emergency

05:00 – Music fandom as an empathetic practice

07:30 – From merch to movement

10:45 – Action hubs and the future of grassroots venues

15:30 – Touring economics, energy costs, and structural limits

19:00 – Artists, activism, and the fear of speaking out

24:30 – Nature, creativity, and why hope needs infrastructure

31:00 – What £500 million could fix in the music ecosystem

35:00 – AI, empathy, and what human music still does best

38:30 – Outro: Depth, not breadth

Continue the Conversation: 

Head to the Drowned in Sound community to chat about the topics in this episode.

Subscribe:

Get weekly essays, interviews, and insights from the Drowned in Sound newsletter - exploring music, culture, and resistance.

Links & Resources:

Music Declares Emergency - Learn more about the No Music On A Dead Planet movement, the Hope Over Fear campaign, and how artists, industry, and fans can get involved.

Music Venue Trust - Support and protect the UK’s grassroots venues

The Green Rider - Ideas for ‘green’ clauses for inclusion as part of your tech or hospitality riders.

Hope Over Fear Campaign - The campaign funding real-world action hubs in grassroots venues, focused on collective climate action and community organising.

No Music On A Dead Planet - The global artist-led movement connecting music, fandom, and climate justice.

About the host:

Sean Adams is the founder of Drowned in Sound, an independent music publication championing underground and independent artists since 2000. DiS explores how music fans discover their collective power through journalism, podcasts, and community organizing.

Related episodes:

- Tori Tsui: "How Music Fans Became Climate Activists" (Brian Eno, Billie Eilish, Fossil Fuel Treaty)

- Giles Bidder: "Why Festival Headliners Still Need Part-Time Jobs" (101 Part Time Jobs, touring economics)

- EarthSonic Live: Music, ecology, and collective action from Manchester Museum

About Ella Harris:

Ella Harris is the front-person and vocalist of London post-punk/electronic trio PVA, whose second album 'No More Like This' (produced by Kwake Bass) explores desire, devotion, and emotional indentation through trip-hop-influenced soundscapes. 

As Campaigns Manager for Music Declares Emergency, she leads the Hope Over Fear campaign, establishing action hubs in grassroots venues across the UK and Ireland. Previously, she founded Group Therapy Collective during lockdown, releasing two compilations featuring Yard Act, Mandy Indiana, and others to raise funds for Help Musicians, Black Minds Matter, and Music Venue Trust.

Guest links:

- PVA on Bandcamp: https://pvaareok.bandcamp.com

- PVA on Instagram: @pva_are_ok

- Ella Harris on Instagram: @lime.zoda

Many who otherwise couldn't afford a £40 show, let alone a £300 festival ticket, have accessed gigs because of a new initiative called The Ticket Bank.

In this episode, DiS founder Sean Adams meets Jack from Tickets for Good and The Ticket Bank to understand how they're redistributing access to live music. From seeing empty seats at the O2 to a partnership with Barnardo's, followed by offering tickets to NHS workers, teachers, and carers, Jack explains how the infrastructure works, who it serves, and why more artists and venues need to get involved.

The conversation covers touring economics, dynamic pricing myths, and the uncomfortable reality that an industry generating billions still prices out the people who need culture most. If you're singing about inequality, why would you only perform for those who can afford it?

It’s an inspiring chat about who builds community, how change happens, and who the next generation of artists might not be without projects like this.

This podcast is brought to you in partnership with Qobuz, the ethical music streaming platform. Visit drownedinsound.org/playlists to discover new music in Hi-Res lossless quality and start your 30-day free trial at qobuz.com/dis. 

This week's companion playlist features calm, ambient music from the community's picks of the best post-classical, drone, and ambient records. Two hours of peaceful listening to help you through the fog. 

Edited by: 

Josh Craggs at Dubble Audio

Get Involved
For artists, promoters, managers, venues: Contact Jack directly to discuss partnerships Email: [email protected] 

For eligible audiences: Register via Tickets for Good or the Ticket Bank. New events added daily around 9am.

Tickets for Good: https://ticketsforgood.co.uk

Ticket Bank: https://theticketbank.org

For everyone else:

Share this episode with musicians, venues, and local promoters

Tag artists in the comments and ask if they've heard of the Ticket Bank

Send to your MP or local council about arts access

If you know someone who might qualify, subtly share the links

Continue the Conversation
Join the Drowned in Sound community to discuss this episode http://community.drownedinsound.com 

Subscribe to the Drowned in Sound newsletter for weekly essays, interviews, and insights exploring music, culture, and collective power. http://drownedinsound.org 

Links & Resources

Tickets for Good: https://ticketsforgood.co.uk 

Ticket Bank: https://theticketbank.org 

Music Venue Trust: https://www.musicvenuetrust.com

Chapters
00:00 - Introduction: Why access to live music matters

01:20 - Empty seats at the O2: The origins of Tickets for Good

05:10 - Cost-of-living tickets and breaking industry stigma

07:00 - From Tickets for Good to the Ticket Bank

12:00 - How eligibility and verification work

16:00 - Touring economics and the dynamic pricing myth

18:15 - How artists, promoters, and managers can help

22:15 - Mental health, social prescribing, and cultural value

24:45 - What £500 million could fix

27:15 - Grassroots venues and inspiring the next generation

31:00 - How to register, donate tickets, or get involved

33:30 - Outro: Your mission

Picking up where Part 1 left off, DiS returns to its conversation with Giles Bidder. Not to talk about how musicians survive, but about how stories travel, how listeners connect and what it really takes to build a music podcast in 2026.

In this second instalment, Sean Adams turns the lens on the medium itself (yes, we’ve gone meta). Drawing on nearly 600 episodes of 101 Part Time Jobs, Giles reflects on the craft of interviewing, the ethics of editing, and why the best conversations often need space to breathe. This is less about hustle and more about care: how to hold people well, how to listen properly, and how to build trust over time.

The conversation ranges from standout episodes and “slow-burn” storytelling to what it feels like to make work that actually helps people navigate their lives. Giles speaks openly about bad bosses, fear-based workplaces, and the quiet anger that fuels his show (as well as the small, human moments that make it worthwhile).

A love for radio runs through this episode: Giles describes producing Shaun Keaveny’s Community Garden Radio as a lesson in warmth, humour, and emotional intelligence on air. From there, the pair broaden out into why podcasts have become such a powerful space for connection, especially for people stuck in boring jobs, long commutes, or lonely routines.

Visit https://drownedinsound.org/playlists/ to discover new music in rich Hi-Res lossless quality and start your 30-day free trial of Qobuz at https://qobuz.com/dis.

Edited by: 

Josh Craggs at Dubble Audio

Chapters
00:00 - Intro
01:30 - Standout episodes and “slow-burn” editing
03:20 - When to cut vs when to let a story breathe
05:10 - What makes a “good” episode in hindsight
07:00 - Work gaffs, embarrassment, and shared vulnerability
12:00 - Bad bosses, anger, and fear-based workplaces
14:00 - Why people are quietly quitting
18:00 - Why podcasts work on boring journeys
21:00 - Community Garden Radio and the art of warmth
22:30 - What great broadcasting feels like
24:00 - Power, responsibility, and attention
25:30 - Why trust matters more than reach
27:00 - Outro

Continue the Conversation: 

Head to the Drowned in Sound community to chat about the topics in this episode.

Subscribe:

Get weekly essays, interviews, and insights from the Drowned in Sound newsletter - exploring music, culture, and resistance.

From scout-hut gigs to the economics of touring, DiS sits down with Giles Bidder - host of 101 Part Time Jobs for an unsentimental look at how creative lives are actually sustained today.

In this first instalment, Sean Adams talks to one of the UK’s most quietly compelling broadcasters about the hidden labour behind music culture. Over nearly 600 episodes, Bidder has built one of the most humane music podcasts around, asking artists, writers, and comedians not about their success but about the jobs they’ve done to survive.

Giles explains how 101 Part Time Jobs emerged as both portfolio and refuge: a way to make sense of a patchwork career, rediscover belonging, and document how people navigate a system that rarely works in their favour. Along the way, the conversation takes in touring economics, merch, sync, class, and why even bands who play the Roundhouse still need “normal jobs.

What emerges is a stark but generous thesis: music is socially priceless and economically precarious. Until that gap closes, culture will continue to run on grit, goodwill, and vast amounts of invisible labour.

Visit https://drownedinsound.org/playlists/ to discover new music in rich Hi-Res lossless quality and start your 30-day free trial of Qobuz at https://qobuz.com/dis.

Chapters

00:00 - Intro 

01:26 - Sitting in the “other chair”: Giles as guest, not host

04:05 - Ska/punk origins, micro-prejudices, and how scenes teach you

07:45 - Why 101 Part Time Jobs began: Universal Credit, lockdown, stability

08:55 - Human curation and introducing unknown artists

11:25 - The myth of “making it”: Roundhouse bands with day jobs

13:55 - Why meaningful art can still leave artists broke

16:10 - Music is priceless but paid in grains of pennies

18:20 - Gilla Band, Lambrini Girls, and invisible cultural impact

19:25 - Class, rent, and the radical idea of simply covering your life

20:15 - Why customer-facing jobs matter (merch, coffee shops, respect)

23:55 - Hard work, timing, and opportunity

25:20 - Standout episodes and the “slow-burn” edit

29:10 - Bad bosses, anger, and fear-based workplaces

31:55 - Power, responsibility, and attention in podcasting

44:07 - The importance of having your own project and taking the time

46:55 - Outro

Continue the Conversation: 

Head to the Drowned in Sound community to chat about the topics in this episode.

Subscribe:

Get weekly essays, interviews, and insights from the Drowned in Sound newsletter - exploring music, culture, and resistance.

Links & Resources:

101 Part Time Jobs (Giles Bidder) 

Community Garden Radio (Shaun Keaveny) 

Music Venue Trust - protecting grassroots venues 

Gilla Band 

Lambrini Girls 

Soho Radio

Reading Festival

From scout-hut gigs to the economics of touring, DiS sits down with Giles Bidder - host of 101 Part Time Jobs for an unsentimental look at how creative lives are actually sustained today.

In this first instalment, Sean Adams talks to one of the UK’s most quietly compelling broadcasters about the hidden labour behind music culture. Over nearly 600 episodes, Bidder has built one of the most humane music podcasts around, asking artists, writers, and comedians not about their success but about the jobs they’ve done to survive.

Giles explains how 101 Part Time Jobs emerged as both portfolio and refuge: a way to make sense of a patchwork career, rediscover belonging, and document how people navigate a system that rarely works in their favour. Along the way, the conversation takes in touring economics, merch, sync, class, and why even bands who play the Roundhouse still need “normal jobs.”

What emerges is a stark but generous thesis: music is socially priceless and economically precarious. Until that gap closes, culture will continue to run on grit, goodwill, and vast amounts of invisible labour.

Visit https://drownedinsound.org/playlists/ to discover new music in rich Hi-Res lossless quality and start your 30-day free trial of Qobuz at https://qobuz.com/dis.

Edited by: 

Josh Craggs at Dubble Audio

Chapters

00:00 - Intro 

01:26 - Sitting in the “other chair”: Giles as guest, not host

04:05 - Ska/punk origins, micro-prejudices, and how scenes teach you

07:45 - Why 101 Part Time Jobs began: Universal Credit, lockdown, stability

08:55 - Human curation and introducing unknown artists

11:25 - The myth of “making it”: Roundhouse bands with day jobs

13:55 - Why meaningful art can still leave artists broke

16:10 - Music is priceless but paid in grains of pennies

18:20 - Gilla Band, Lambrini Girls, and invisible cultural impact

19:25 - Class, rent, and the radical idea of simply covering your life

20:15 - Why customer-facing jobs matter (merch, coffee shops, respect)

23:55 - Hard work, timing, and opportunity

25:20 - Standout episodes and the “slow-burn” edit

29:10 - Bad bosses, anger, and fear-based workplaces

31:55 - Power, responsibility, and attention in podcasting

Continue the Conversation: 

Head to the Drowned in Sound community to chat about the topics in this episode.

Subscribe:

Get weekly essays, interviews, and insights from the Drowned in Sound newsletter - exploring music, culture, and resistance.

Links & Resources

101 Part Time Jobs (Giles Bidder) 

Community Garden Radio (Shaun Keaveny) 

Music Venue Trust - protecting grassroots venues 

Gilla Band 

Lambrini Girls 

Soho Radio

Reading Festival