The Underground

Gemma Haigh’s route into horticulture hasn’t exactly been conventional.
After starting her career in museums and heritage, she turned a lifelong love of plants into The Plant Parlour, working across houseplants, content creation, design and interior landscaping. She also created a Houseplant Studio for the 2024 RHS Chelsea Flower Show, inspired, perhaps unexpectedly, by the post-apocalyptic world of The Last of Us.
But this conversation goes well beyond houseplants.
Gemma joins Phil and Kate to talk about why industries driven by passion can become comfortable with expecting people to work for very little, the difficulty of putting a proper value on horticultural expertise, and whether women face additional barriers when trying to make a career in the sector.
They also discuss caring responsibilities, the treatment of women online, why follower numbers and genuine expertise aren’t the same thing, and what brands should be looking for when they work with creators.
And, returning to plants, Gemma explains why climate change could start to blur the distinction between what we think of as an indoor plant and an outdoor plant.
It’s a wide-ranging conversation about plants, careers, expertise and what it takes to be taken seriously in horticulture.
In this episode:
How an overflowing garden led Gemma into houseplants
Creating a Houseplant Studio at RHS Chelsea Flower Show
Why passion shouldn’t be used as an excuse for poor pay
Whether horticulture properly values professional expertise
Women, caring responsibilities and career progression
The difference between influence, entertainment and genuine authority
Why brands need to think harder about who represents them
How our changing climate could change the way we grow houseplants

Glee is one of the biggest dates in the garden industry calendar. It’s also three very long days of walking, talking, networking, discovering new products and trying to remember who said what by the time you get home.So, ahead of Glee 2026, we’ve delved back into Season 1 of The Underground and brought together some of the best Glee survival advice from our guests.
And between them, they’ve clocked up a lot of exhibition miles.
We hear tips from garden centre leaders, suppliers, marketers, PR professionals, journalists, growers and industry organisations on how to get more from the show, whether you’re exhibiting or visiting.
There’s plenty of practical advice: comfortable shoes, hydration, planning your meetings, taking useful notes, making time to explore every aisle and following up properly afterwards.
But there are some bigger lessons too. How do you make the most of chance conversations? What should an exhibitor actually be trying to achieve? Why should your product packaging be able to sell the story without somebody standing beside it? And why might staying until the very last bell lead to a customer relationship that lasts ten years?
You’ll also discover the importance of yoga, a good breakfast, emergency plasters, strategic coffee consumption and, apparently, the correct way to end a conversation.
Featuring advice from Alan Roper, Boyd Douglas-Davies, Debi Holland, Elaine Gotts, Ellen Mary, Fran Barnes, Guy Jenkins, Jane Hartley, Jane Lawler, Kate Ebbens, Kimberley Hornby-George, Linda Petrons, Matthew Mein, Megan Warren-Davis, Michael Perry, Simon Taylor, Steve Harper, Toby Thomas, Vicky Nuttall and Will Scott.
The Underground is the official podcast partner of Glee 2026.

With Glee just a month away, we’re heading back to Birmingham, as well as the conversations we recorded there last year.
At Glee 2025, we asked every guest who joined us one simple question:
What’s one change you’d love to see in the garden sector over the next five years?The answers gave us a fascinating snapshot of where the industry thought change was needed.
We heard calls for more young people to discover gardening and horticulture, better training for people entering the industry, greater support for independent garden centres and much more ambitious use of digital technology. Our guests also talked about sustainability, peat-free growing media, water conservation, online retail, AI and how garden centres themselves could evolve.
There were plenty of big ideas too, from turning garden centres into evening destinations to rethinking the way plants are merchandised.
A year on, and with the industry preparing to come together at Glee again, it feels like the perfect time to revisit those conversations.
Which ideas are beginning to happen? Which challenges are still with us? And if we asked the same question at Glee this year, would the answers be any different?Featuring voices from across garden retail, horticulture, suppliers, marketing and the wider garden sector.

From a four-acre smallholding growing strawberries and potatoes to three award-winning garden centres, Perrywood’s story is one of family, plants and steady growth.
In this episode, Phil and Kate talk to Hannah Powell, HR and Communications Director at Perrywood Garden Centres, about how the business has expanded without losing the values that shaped it. Hannah explains why plants remain at the heart of Perrywood, how industry standards have encouraged continuous improvement, and why knowledgeable, well-supported teams are central to the customer experience.
They also discuss attracting younger customers, the power of a successful loyalty programme, making sustainable choices, the pressures facing garden centre businesses and how climate change could affect what customers grow in the future.
Along the way, Hannah shares why gardening is her therapy and how a visit to a garden centre can offer people far more than a shopping trip.

This week, the tables are turned as Kate interviews The Underground co-host Phil Wright, co-founder of creative marketing agency WrightObara.Phil recently wrote an in-depth article exploring how people choose one product over another. In this conversation, he explains why those decisions are rarely driven by facts, features and price alone — and why good creative marketing needs to do more than simply explain what a product does.The discussion begins with Phil’s slightly irrational desire for an iPod Nano and develops into a wider conversation about emotion, gut feeling, brand perception, strategy and creativity.
Phil and Kate explore:

Why rational versus irrational is often the wrong distinction

How brands become a collection of promises and experiences

Why research and analysis are not the same as strategy

How creativity helps products get noticed, understood and remembered

The emotions that can influence even practical garden purchases

Why brands need to persuade both the retail buyer and the shopper

Whether emotional marketing is persuasive or manipulative

Why explaining a product is rarely enough to make people want it

It is also a chance to learn a little more about Phil, the thinking behind WrightObara and why understanding how people choose has become central to the agency’s work.
Read Phil’s full article, How people choose: emotion, reason and the power of creative marketing: https://wrightobara.com/blog/how-people-choose-emotion-reason-and-the-power-of-creative-marketing/

Find out more about WrightObara: www.wrightobara.com