263 episodes
5.54 Michael Clary, Trent Hunter, & Stephen Wellum • Interview • "Bringing Religion into Politics: Five Things Pastors Owe to the Public Square"
16/10/2026 | 1h 2 mins.ABOUT THE EPISODE
Listen in as Trent Hunter & Stephen Wellum interview Michael Clary on his latest COA Longform Essay, "Bringing Religion into Politics: Five Things Pastors Owe to the Public Square"
Resources to Click
“Bringing Religion into Politics: Five Things Pastors Owe to the Public Square” – Michael Clary
The Baptist Faith and Message 2000: Article XV
Theme of the Month: Pastors (Should We) Be Political
Give to Support the Work
Books to Read
Loser Theology: Why the Weak Will Not Inherit the Earth – Michael Clary
The Collected Works of G.K. Chesterton: The Illustrated London News 1911-1913 – G.K. Chesterton5.53 Michael Clary • Reading • "Bringing Religion into Politics: Five Things Pastors Owe to the Public Square"
14/10/2026 | 35 mins.ABOUT THE EPISODE
Oftentimes pastors are praised for keeping politics out of their sermons. What if we told you that’s actually a failure to shepherd God’s flock?
Resources to Click
“Bringing Religion into Politics: Five Things Pastors Owe to the Public Square” – Michael Clary
The Baptist Faith and Message 2000: Article XV
Theme of the Month: Pastors (Should We) Be Political
Give to Support the Work
Books to Read
Loser Theology: Why the Weak Will Not Inherit the Earth – Michael Clary
The Collected Works of G.K. Chesterton: The Illustrated London News 1911-1913 – G.K. Chesterton5.52 Levi Secord, James Baird, & David Schrock • Interview • Is Big Government Christian?: A Review of James Baird's King of Kings/Too Small to Succeed: A Review and Response to Servant Not Savior
12/10/2026 | 1h 36 mins.ABOUT THE EPISODE
Join David Schrock, Levi Secord, & James Baird for this lively discussion and debate on their two respective books dealing with matters of church and state
Timestamps
00:00 – Intro
03:00 – Meet the Pastors: James Baird and Levi Secord
07:11 – How Ecclesiology and Eschatology Inform Political Views
25:36 – Unpacking Secord’s and Baird’s Core Arguments
37:14 – The Scope of State Power and Blasphemy Laws
56:27 – Is Government Inherently Good or Bad?
1:06:58 – The Role of Classical Thinkers in Christian Political Thought
1:18:30 – Re-Examining Blasphemy Laws and Speech Enforcement
1:33:06 – Recommended Resources
Resources to Click
“Too Small to Succeed: A Review and Response to Levi Secord’s Servant Not Savior” – James Baird
“Is Big Government Christian? A Review of James Baird’s King of Kings” – Levi Secord
“Everson Must Fall” – Timon Cline, Josh Hammer & Yoram Hazony
“Blasphemy and the Original Meaning of The First Amendment” – Harvard Law Review
“King of Kings: A Reformed Guide to Christian Government” – Conversations That Matter Podcast
“Post-War Consensus & Strong Gods, Kevin DeYoung w/ James Baird” – Grace at the Gates Podcast
“6 Questions for Christian Nationalists” – Kevin DeYoung
Theme of the Month: Pastors (Should We) Be Political
Give to Support the Work
Books to Read
King of Kings: A Reformed Guide to Christian Government – James Baird
Servant Not Savior: An Introduction to the Bible’s Teaching about Civil Government – Levi Secord
Reforming the Law of Nature: The Secularization of Political Thought, 1532-1689 – Simon P. Kennedy
Did America Have a Christian Founding? Separating Modern Myth from Historical Truth – Mark David Hall
Disestablishment and Religious Dissent: Church-State Relations in the New American States, 1776-1833 – Carl H. Esbeck and Jonathan J. Den Hartog
Religion and Republic: Christian America from the Founding to the Civil War – Miles Smith5.51 Levi Secord & James Baird • Reading • "Is Big Government Christian?: A Review of James Baird's King of Kings/Too Small to Succeed: A Review and Response to Levi Secord's Servant Not Savior
06/10/2026 | 45 mins.ABOUT THE EPISODE
Plato or Paul? See how Levi Secord defends his book “Servant Not Savior” in response to James Baird’s arguments. • Despite their many points of agreement, James Baird takes a stand for his book “King of Kings” against Levi Secord’s arguments.
Resources to Click
“Too Small to Succeed: A Review and Response to Levi Secord’s Servant Not Savior” – James Baird
“Is Big Government Christian? A Review of James Baird’s King of Kings” – Levi Secord
“Everson Must Fall” – Timon Cline, Josh Hammer & Yoram Hazony
“Blasphemy and the Original Meaning of The First Amendment” – Harvard Law Review
“King of Kings: A Reformed Guide to Christian Government” – Conversations That Matter Podcast
“Post-War Consensus & Strong Gods, Kevin DeYoung w/ James Baird” – Grace at the Gates Podcast
“6 Questions for Christian Nationalists” – Kevin DeYoung
Theme of the Month: Pastors (Should We) Be Political
Give to Support the Work
Books to Read
King of Kings: A Reformed Guide to Christian Government – James Baird
Servant Not Savior: An Introduction to the Bible’s Teaching about Civil Government – Levi Secord
Reforming the Law of Nature: The Secularization of Political Thought, 1532-1689 – Simon P. Kennedy
Did America Have a Christian Founding? Separating Modern Myth from Historical Truth – Mark David Hall
Disestablishment and Religious Dissent: Church-State Relations in the New American States, 1776-1833 – Carl H. Esbeck and Jonathan J. Den Hartog
Religion and Republic: Christian America from the Founding to the Civil War – Miles Smith5.50 David Schrock, Stephen Wellum, & Trent Hunter • Interview • “Set Apart For Worship: Ten Words about the Fourth Commandment”
28/09/2026 | 47 mins.ABOUT THE EPISODE
Listen in as Stephen Wellum and Trent Hunter interview David Schrock on his COA Longform Essay "Set Apart for Worship: Ten Words about the Fourth Commandment" and speak on what it means to hold a Progressive Covenantal view of the Sabbath.
Timestamps
· 00:00 – Intro
· 04:30 – Unpacking the Sabbath: A ComplexCommandment for Christians
· 13:48 – How Christ Brings Fulfillment to theSabbath Command
· 23:30 – David Schrock on the Missing WorshipElement in Sabbath Theology
· 38:53 – Applying Sabbath Principles: The NewTestament and the Church’s Gathering
· 46:40 - Outro
Resources to Click
“Set Apart for Worship: Ten Words about the Fourth Commandment” – David Schrock
“Remember the Sabbath: Israel’s Covenant Sign Fulfilled in Christ, Part 1” – Ardel Caneday
“Remember the Sabbath: Israel’s Covenant Sign Fulfilled in Christ, Part 2” – Ardel Caneday
“Remember the Sabbath: Israel’s Covenant Sign Fulfilled in Christ, Part 3” – Ardel Caneday
“The Three Most Important Words I Learned in Seminary: ‘Textual, Epochal, Canonical” – David Schrock
“The Ten Commandments and the Literary Structure of Deuteronomy” – Josh Philpot
“How a Kingdom of Priests Became a Kingdom with Priests and Levies: A Filial Corporate Understanding of the Royal Priesthood in Exodus 19:6” – David Schrock
“Adam as the First Priest in Eden as the Garden Temple” – G.K. Beale
“The Death Penalty in the Mosaic Law” – Peter J. Leithart
Theme of the Month: The Ten Commandments: Yesterday, Today, and Forever
Give to Support the Work
Books to Read
Christ Will Give You Rest: A Biblical Theology of the Sabbath – Beau Landers
Obey the Sabbath: Rest in Christ – Blake White
“Goodbye and Hello: The Sabbath Command for New Covenant Believers” by Thomas R. Schreiner in Progressive Covenantalism: Charting A Course between Dispensational and Covenantal Theologies – Stephen J. Wellum & Brent E. Parker
Religion and Republic: Christian America from the Founding to the Civil War – Miles Smith
The Fabric of Theology: A Prolegomenon to Evangelical Theology – Richard Lints
The Structure of Biblical Authority – Meredith G. Kline
A Royal Priesthood: Literary and Intertextual Perspectives on an Image of Israel in Exodus 19.6 – John A. Davies
Ezekiel the Priest: A Custodian of Tórâ – T.J. Betts
The Lord’s Service: The Grace of Covenant Renewal Worship – Jeffrey J. Meyers
From the Finger of God: The Biblical and Theological Basis for the Threefold Division of the Law – Philip S. Ross
We Become What We Worship: A Biblical Theology of Idolatry – G.K. Beale
Theological Lexicon of the Old Testament – Ernst Jenni, Claus Westermann
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