The Non-Billable Podcast

John Hutchinson, managing partner of top 100 law firm Broadfield, joins the podcast to discuss the firm’s transformation from BDB Pitmans into a tech-enabled, internationally focused mid-market player.
He explains the thinking behind the rebrand and the partnership with SHP, a subsidiary of Alvarez & Marsal, designed to support investment in technology, talent and global expansion.
He outlines how that relationship works in practice, with Broadfield remaining independent but gaining access to infrastructure, strategic insight and tools like Harvey. The goal is to build a more integrated, end-to-end platform for delivering legal services, while improving efficiency and client value.
Hutchinson also shares his perspective on private equity in law, arguing it works for some firms but isn’t the only model. Broadfield is instead focused on long-term growth, international reach and more "sensible pricing", moving beyond simply increasing hourly rates.
Looking ahead, the firm is targeting expansion across Europe and the the Middle East, with a focus on private capital and cross-border work. Hutchinson says success in today’s market will come down to combining technology, talent and a clear value proposition for clients.
The Non-Billable Podcast is sponsored by Legora. To find out more about Legora, visit: https://legora.com/
Today’s episode is also supported by Definely. To find out more about Definely, visit: https://www.definely.com/nonbillable
Chapters
00:01 Introduction
02:40 From BDB Pitmans to Broadfield: the rebrand and strategy shift
06:18 The Alvarez & Marsal connection and tech-driven model
09:55 Private equity in law firms: opportunity and limits
14:12 Building an international platform: US, Hong Kong and beyond
17:43 The mid-market squeeze and rethinking pricing models
22:09 AI, Harvey and the impact on law firm economics
24:21 Leadership, culture and managing rapid change
27:25 Hiring strategy and attracting the next generation of partners
About Non-Billable
Non-Billable is the media company for modern legal professionals across private practice, in-house and legal tech.
Visit our website: ⁠⁠https://www.nonbillable.co.uk

Pierre Proner is the CEO and co-founder of Lawhive. He joins the podcast to explain how his company is combining AI with a regulated law firm model to rethink consumer legal services. He shares how Lawhive pivoted from initially offering software to law firms, driven by a mission to improve access to legal help and reduce the inefficiencies in how consumer law is delivered.
He discusses why selling software to traditional firms only went so far, with resistance tied to billable hours and legacy models. That led Lawhive to become a law firm itself, building an end-to-end AI operating system that supports everything from client intake to drafting and back-office work, with lawyers staying firmly “in the loop”.
The episode also breaks down how the model works across markets. In the UK, Lawhive uses a consultancy-style platform, while in the US it operates through an Arizona ABS and a co-counsel network. Proner says the tech can significantly increase lawyer productivity and earnings by reducing non-billable work.
Finally, he talks about growth. With over $100 million raised, Lawhive is now focused on scaling in the US through expansion and acquisitions, aiming to build a global consumer law firm powered by AI.
The Non-Billable Podcast is sponsored by Legora. To find out more about Legora, visit: https://legora.com/
Today’s episode is also supported by Definely. To find out more about Definely, visit: https://www.definely.com/nonbillable
Chapters
00:01 Introduction
01:20 From fintech to legal tech: the origin of Lawhive
03:41 Building an AI operating system for consumer law
06:19 Why selling software to law firms wasn’t enough
07:47 Becoming a regulated law firm and changing the model
10:03 Inside the Lawhive platform: AI across the full workflow
13:05 Productivity gains, margins and lawyer economics
17:05 UK vs US: consultancy model and co-counsel expansion
21:06 Funding, US growth and the ambition to build a global consumer law firm
About Non-Billable
Non-Billable is the media company for modern legal professionals across private practice, in-house and legal tech.
Visit our website: ⁠⁠https://www.nonbillable.co.uk

Ropes & Gray has been quietly rolling out one of the most ambitious European growth strategies among US firms in London. In this episode, London managing partner Rohan Massey and antitrust partner Ruchit Patel, who also sits on the firm’s governing policy committee, join the show to discuss how the firm has grown its London office from a two-partner launch in 2010 into a 250-person hub.
We talk about the firm’s push across Europe, including the recent launches in Paris and Milan, and why Ropes sees London as the centre of a broader European platform. Patel explains how the strategy is driven primarily by client demand - particularly from private capital clients - and why the firm has chosen to build a single integrated European platform rather than operate offices as separate profit centres.
The conversation also explores the competitive dynamics of the London market, where US firms have dramatically expanded over the past decade. Massey and Patel discuss how Ropes thinks about talent, lateral hiring and institutionalising client relationships, including why the firm emphasises collaboration across offices and practice groups.
Finally, we get into one of the firm’s more unusual strategic choices: sticking with a single-tier, all-equity partnership while much of the legal industry moves towards multi-tier structures.
The Non-Billable Podcast is sponsored by Legora. To find out more about Legora, visit: https://legora.com/
Today’s episode is also supported by Definely. To find out more about Definely, visit: https://www.definely.com/nonbillable
Chapters
00:01 Introduction
01:44 The origins and growth of Ropes & Gray’s London office
04:31 The rise of US law firms in London
05:43 Ropes & Gray’s European private capital strategy
09:57 Paris and Milan: the firm’s newest growth engines
11:30 Why Ropes believes collaboration is its competitive edge
14:45 Talent, lateral hiring and building the partnership
17:47 Institutionalising client relationships across the firm
20:08 Why Ropes is sticking with a single-tier equity partnership
About Non-Billable
Non-Billable is the media company for modern legal professionals across private practice, in-house and legal tech.
Visit our website: ⁠⁠https://www.nonbillable.co.uk

Legal tech has gone from “let’s run a few pilots” to “we need to scale this across the whole firm” - and Peter Duffy says that shift is now well underway in the UK’s top law firms firms.
Peter is the founder of Titans, a boutique legal tech and AI consultancy advising large law firms, and he joins the podcast to take the temperature of the market and explain why things feel like they’ve accelerated so sharply in the past year.
We dig into how firms are buying right now: a strategic bet on a general-purpose legal AI platform - with Harvey and Legora emerging as the leading contenders at the top end - and then a layer of point solutions where the platform workflows still leave gaps. Peter also explains why many in-house tools made sense early on, but why firms are increasingly hitting a ceiling trying to compete with well-funded vendors shipping at startup speed.
Peter weighs in on the recent chaos around Anthropic’s legal tools and why he thinks the market reaction was knee-jerk. “If I was to run an RFP… that would absolutely not be in the top 10,” he says, arguing the product is still nowhere near what specialist vendors can do today - even if the direction of travel is obvious.
Finally, we talk moats and where legal tech competition is heading next: why Peter doesn’t think bespoke LLMs are the differentiator right now, why workflow-fit and enterprise readiness matter more than people think, and why the smartest move for law firm leaders is simple: make sure the whole workforce is AI fluent - while avoiding the temptation to burn money trying to outbuild the vendors.
The Non-Billable Podcast is sponsored by Legora. To find out more about Legora, visit: https://legora.com/
Chapters
00:01 Introduction
01:41 Taking the temperature of the legal AI market
04:02 From pilots to platforms: how firms are buying AI
06:32 What the leading legal AI platforms actually offer
09:56 How much law firms are investing in AI
10:53 Copilot, in-house tools and the limits of DIY AI
13:08 The platform power law: Harvey, Legora and the funding gap
25:10 Anthropic, incumbents and the battle for legal infrastructure
33:55 The smartest AI decision law firm leaders can make
About Non-Billable
Non-Billable is the media company for modern legal professionals across private practice, in-house and legal tech.
Visit our website: ⁠⁠https://www.nonbillable.co.uk

In this episode, we sit down with DWF CEO Matt Doughty to discuss what comes next for the UK’s biggest private equity-owned law firm.
We discuss DWF’s positioning today: a 5,000-strong global business generating more than £500 million in revenue, split roughly 50-50 between insurance services and commercial legal work. Doughty explains why the firm is doubling down on five core market groups and why “discipline” and clarity about a firm’s “right to win” matter more than chasing the latest trend.
A major theme of the conversation is, understandably, capital. Doughty revisits DWF’s 2019 IPO - the largest law firm listing at the time - and what life was really like as a public company, from market disclosures to share price scrutiny.
He reflects on the challenges of telling a complex equity story to investors, the impact of macroeconomic headwinds, and what ultimately changed when private equity firm Inflexion took the business private in 2023.
Now operating under PE backing, Doughty outlines why he believes private equity isn’t right for every firm, and why he doesn’t expect a “tidal wave” of investment into Big Law.
The Non-Billable Podcast is sponsored by Legora. To find out more about Legora, visit: https://legora.com/
Chapters
00:01 Introduction
01:20 Taking over as CEO and following Nigel Knowles
02:45 Leadership style and protecting DWF’s culture
06:32 DWF today: insurance, commercial and global scale
09:34 The five market groups driving growth
13:12 Why DWF chose to IPO in 2019
15:46 Life as a listed law firm: governance and share price pressure
24:22 Going private: the Inflexion deal and PE backing
34:21 Why private equity isn’t right for every law firm
About Non-Billable
Non-Billable is the media company for modern legal professionals across private practice, in-house and legal tech.
Visit our website: ⁠⁠https://www.nonbillable.co.uk