Adulting with Autism

You know what you need to do.
You have the list. You have the planner. You might even have an entire Notion dashboard that looks like it belongs in a productivity commercial.
So why is the thing still not getting done?
In this episode of Adulting with Autism, I talk with Kevin Bailey, an executive-functioning and resilience coach and the creator of Go Beyond Knowing. Kevin works with neurodivergent professionals who are capable, creative, and working hard—but struggle to turn what they know into consistent action without overwhelming themselves.
We explore why a task can be harder than it looks, when breaking it into smaller steps helps, and when more planning becomes another obstacle. Kevin introduces five "stuck points"—doubt, overwhelm, friction, isolation, and drift—and a flexible loop for moving work forward: Decide, Plan, Start, Continue, and Reflect.
We also discuss deadline panic, low-stakes accountability, changing systems when novelty fades, and why sometimes the next step is not another productivity experiment. Sometimes your capacity is depleted, and you need support rather than another demand.
This conversation is for autistic, ADHD, and other neurodivergent adults who are tired of wondering why knowing the answer has not made doing the task any easier.
In This Episode, We Cover
p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Why Kevin created Go Beyond Knowing.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> The gap between collecting information and applying it in daily life.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Different reasons for getting stuck: not knowing the next step, struggling to start, or lacking capacity.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Why a beautiful plan does not guarantee follow-through.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> The "healthy pause": observing what is happening before adding another strategy.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Kevin's five stuck points: doubt, overwhelm, friction, isolation, and drift.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Looking back at similar tasks to identify what has helped before.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> When detailed planning becomes more work than the original task.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Design thinking: adapting a system to its user rather than forcing the user to fit it.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Why organized chaos may be functional even if it is not visually impressive.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Accountability you choose rather than monitoring that makes you feel judged.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Decide, Plan, Start, Continue, Reflect as a repeating loop.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Planning how to return to work—not only how to begin.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Assessing the cost of relying on last-minute urgency.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> "Paper tiger deadlines": earlier check-ins with lower stakes.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Why a useful system does not have to last forever.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Trying small, time-limited experiments instead of committing to a perfect routine.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Accounting for sensory demands, burnout, and changing capacity.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Rebuilding self-trust with both compassion and honest reflection.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Kevin's Follow-Through Self-Check and 30-minute Clarity Call.

Kevin's Frameworks at a Glance
These are Kevin's coaching models as described in the interview—not diagnostic categories or universal rules.
Five Stuck Points
p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Doubt

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Overwhelm

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Friction

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Isolation

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Drift

Kevin uses these as starting points for exploring what may be interfering with progress. He notes that more than one can be present at the same time.
The Follow-Through Loop
p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Decide: Identify what you want to do.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Plan: Consider the steps, timing, and resources.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Start: Begin the first part of the work.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Continue: Create a way to return and keep track.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Reflect: Notice what happened, recognize progress, and adjust.

Kevin emphasizes that this is a loop—not a sequence you must execute perfectly once.
About the Guest
Kevin Bailey is an executive-functioning and resilience coach who works primarily with neurodivergent career professionals, including autistic and ADHD adults and people exploring their needs without a particular label.
His background includes organizational development, leadership, workplace learning, and human-centered problem-solving. Through Go Beyond Knowing, he applies those experiences to helping clients identify barriers, design practical supports, and move from ideas toward action without treating themselves as the problem.
Resources mentioned in the interview:
p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Website: gobeyondknowing.com

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Follow-Through Self-Check: A starting point for exploring information overload, decision difficulties, and unclear or oversized tasks.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Clarity Call: A 30-minute conversation about potential support.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> LinkedIn: Search Kevin Bailey alongside Go Beyond Knowing.

Key Takeaways
p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Knowing what to do and being able to do it are not the same thing.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> More planning is not automatically the answer.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Your experience of similar tasks can contain useful information you have forgotten to use.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> A system should be evaluated by whether it helps—not by whether it looks organized.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Accountability works best when its purpose and format fit the person receiving it.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Starting is only part of follow-through; returning and reflecting matter too.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> A system can be useful for a season without becoming your permanent method.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> When capacity is severely depleted, adding pressure may miss the need for recovery and support.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Self-compassion does not require ignoring recurring problems. You can investigate a pattern without attacking your worth.

What happens when the explanations you were given about your body, your health, and your childhood no longer make sense?
In this episode of Adulting with Autism, I talk with Jordyn Hope, they/she, a survivor expert, national trainer, consultant, and founder of Flourishing Wildly. Their work brings together lived experience and professional education to help healthcare, mental-health, education, and child-protection teams respond more thoughtfully to complex harm.:not([hidden])~:not([hidden]))]:border-soft bg-soft">response2recovery+1
Jordyn shares their experience of Munchausen by proxy abuse, late autism identification, eating-disorder treatment, medical dismissal, and the difficult process of learning to trust their own perceptions.
We discuss why sensationalized coverage can leave survivors questioning whether their experience "counts," how autistic communication can be misunderstood, and why surviving medical abuse does not mean a person has no genuine illnesses or ongoing support needs. Abuse and real medical conditions can coexist.
We also explore curiosity, compassion, medical records, peer support, and the difference between helping someone understand their experience and telling them what their story must be.
This conversation centers the person harmed—not the spectacle surrounding the harm.
Content note: Discussion of child abuse, medical trauma, eating disorders, institutionalization, and references to methods of abuse. Please listen at a pace that works for you.
In This Episode, We Cover
p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> What Jordyn means by "survivor expert": lived experience alongside expertise in the field.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Their work through Flourishing Wildly as a trainer, consultant, and peer-support provider.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Why they use the term "Munchausen by proxy abuse" to keep attention on harm.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> What gets lost when media coverage centers the person causing abuse.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Why a survivor's experience does not need to resemble a highly publicized case to matter.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> The destabilizing experience of reconsidering childhood explanations about illness.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Jordyn's experience of discovering genuine health needs after being told their symptoms were all psychological.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> The role medical records played in their own understanding.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Why records can be illuminating and emotionally overwhelming.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> How autistic communication and unmet needs were misunderstood in Jordyn's experience.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> The harm of treating requests for support as evidence of manipulation.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Making room for uncertainty instead of forcing an "all real" or "all made up" account.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Responding to symptoms with curiosity rather than immediate disbelief.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> The distinction between advocacy for necessary care and concerns about caregiver-caused harm.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Why isolated observations are not enough to establish abuse.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Listening privately and accessibly without assuming a young person will understand what has happened to them.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Recognizing that a person repeating a caregiver's explanation does not automatically make them complicit.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Rebuilding self-trust without demanding perfect certainty about every memory.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Grounding practices that fit the individual.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Beginning with support rather than trying to process an entire history at once.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Why needing sustained care does not make someone "too much."

About the Guest
Jordyn Hope, they/she, is a national trainer, consultant, survivor advocate, and founder of Flourishing Wildly. Their work focuses on Munchausen by proxy abuse, neurodivergence, chronic illness, patient safety, and harm within systems intended to provide care.:not([hidden])~:not([hidden]))]:border-soft bg-soft">response2recovery+1
Jordyn brings survivor experience to training and consultation for healthcare providers, educators, child-protection professionals, mental-health practitioners, and multidisciplinary teams. Their stated focus is helping organizations build safer, more ethical, and more survivor-centered responses.
In this interview, Jordyn also describes their peer-support role as a "liberation doula": walking alongside people rather than promising to fix them.
Find training, consultation, individual-support information, media work, and contact details at flourishingwildly.com.
Key Takeaways
p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Centering the person harmed changes the conversation from sensational storytelling to safety, care, and long-term support.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> One survivor's experience should not become the threshold every other survivor must meet.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Genuine illness and medical abuse are not mutually exclusive.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> A person's communication style, support needs, or uncertainty should not automatically be interpreted as dishonesty.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Records may clarify parts of a history without resolving every question or memory.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Support can make room for uncertainty without dismissing distress or supplying an answer on someone else's behalf.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Needing help is not proof of manipulation, failure, or unwillingness to improve.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> A useful starting point is finding someone who can listen carefully and help identify appropriate resources.

"You're in graduate school."
"You're in a long-term relationship."
"You can carry a conversation."
Okay—but at what cost?
In this episode of Adulting with Autism, I talk with Ryn Rising, a queer, trans, neurodivergent counselor and coach who supports adults navigating late autism and ADHD identification, burnout, masking, identity, and relationships. Their practice offers counseling for Oregon residents and coaching for clients worldwide.
Ryn shares how burnout during graduate school led them to seek an autism assessment and reconsider an earlier bipolar diagnosis. We explore why being able to perform, achieve, or connect socially does not reveal how much effort that performance requires.
Ryn also introduces GRAVY: Gentleness, Rest and recovery, Accommodations, Vital needs, and Your joy. It is their personal framework for bringing more compassion, practical support, and recovery into a life where work, finances, and caregiving cannot simply disappear.
We talk about small changes, rebuilding self-trust, welcoming a client's "no," different processing needs in relationships, and Ryn's experience of moving abroad.
This conversation is for anyone who has finally found language for their experience—and is now asking, "How do I build a life that actually makes room for me?"
Content note: Discussion of mental-health misdiagnosis, medical harm, identity-related stress, and political concerns.
In This Episode, We Cover
p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Ryn's experience of burnout in high school and graduate school.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Moving from understimulation and extra commitments into overload.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Why they sought an autism assessment after an earlier diagnosis they describe as incorrect.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> How late identification brought clarity and closure.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> High masking and the hidden cost of appearing capable.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Why academic success and relationships do not tell the whole story of someone's support needs.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Exploring gendered expectations without reducing trans and nonbinary people to assumptions.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> What self-erasure can look like in everyday decisions.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Rebuilding self-trust after years of overriding discomfort.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Accepting real constraints while identifying demands that can change.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> The five parts of Ryn's GRAVY framework.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Taking micro-steps when a complete lifestyle overhaul is not possible.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Responding to the inner critic when a small step feels "not enough."

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> What lived experience can add to professional support.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Why no identity group is a monolith.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Making room for skepticism, disagreement, and refusal in therapy.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> How Ryn distinguishes the emphasis of their therapy and coaching work.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Moving to the Netherlands and navigating identity across cultures.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Burnout during major life transitions.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Different processing times in relationships.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Pausing a difficult conversation without abandoning it.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Making room for joy after late-identification grief.

The GRAVY Framework
Ryn describes GRAVY as their own organizing framework, informed by approaches they use in therapy and coaching. It is not presented here as a separately validated treatment protocol.
:not([hidden])~:not([hidden]))]:border-soft">  

:not([hidden])~:not([hidden]))]:border-soft bg-raised"> Letter Meaning Focus in the conversation G Gentleness Self-compassion, perfectionism, internalized ableism, and the inner critic R Rest and recovery Sleep, restorative rest, sensory recovery, and reducing demands A Accommodations Accessible routines, executive-function supports, sensory needs, and unmasking when safe V Vital needs Nutrition, hydration, and movement Y Your joy Special interests, play, connection, pleasure, and enjoyment

About the Guest
Ryn Rising, they/them, is a queer, trans, neurodivergent counselor and coach whose work focuses on late identification, burnout, masking exhaustion, identity exploration, life transitions, and relationships. Their approach combines professional training with lived experience and emphasizes collaboration, compassion, curiosity, and practical support.:not([hidden])~:not([hidden]))]:border-soft bg-soft">innerrising+1
Ryn's practice, Inner Rising Counseling and Coaching, offers online counseling for Oregon residents and coaching worldwide.
In this interview, they also discuss their move to the Netherlands and their planned podcast, The Human Therapist Rising, which they describe as a project about the humans behind therapeutic work.
Resources:
p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Inner Rising Counseling and Coaching.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Ryn's professional profile.psychologytoday

Publishing note: The interview names an earlier website, innerrisingwellness.com. The current site found for their practice is innerrising.nl.
Key Takeaways
p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Being able to do something does not reveal its emotional, sensory, or recovery cost.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Late identification can bring relief while also opening new questions about identity and daily life.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Self-trust can develop through noticing needs and responding to them in manageable ways.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Small changes deserve attention without being presented as a substitute for adequate resources or systemic support.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Joy belongs in a conversation about recovery—not only productivity and symptom management.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> A client's disagreement is useful information, not automatically resistance.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Shared lived experience can support understanding without making two people's experiences identical.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Relationship conversations can make room for different processing needs without forcing an immediate agreement.

What does helpful therapy look like when the goal is not simply more eye contact, fewer autistic traits, or appearing more comfortable than you actually feel?
In this episode of Adulting with Autism, I talk with autistic psychotherapist and author Sean Inderbitzen about feeling stuck, rumination, body awareness, connection, and the importance of having a real voice in your own care.
Sean introduces the approach he calls applied neural exercises: practices that invite curiosity and nonjudgmental attention to bodily experience. We discuss his use of polyvagal theory as a therapeutic framework, while exploring a broader question: what does this particular person want help with, and how will we know whether the support is working?
We also talk about masking in context, sensory environments, basic needs, and why an approach that helps one person may not fit another. During the conversation, I demonstrate the movement I use while interviewing—and we notice what happens when I pay attention to how it feels.
One of the most useful questions from the episode is one you can bring to a prospective therapist:
"How do you respond when a client tells you that you're wrong?"
Because support should include room to disagree, correct a misunderstanding, change direction, and say when something is not helping.
Content note: This conversation includes grief, trauma, and brief discussion of suicidal thoughts and a potentially distressing clinical example.
In This Episode, We Cover
p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Sean's experience as an autistic psychotherapist and author.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Why he wishes autism had been discussed more openly earlier in his life.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> The personal vulnerability involved in writing about his own experience.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> What he means by "neural exercises."

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Flexibility and connection as individualized goals—not universal demands.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Looking at wellbeing across a person's relationship with themselves, close relationships, wider social life, and life overall.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Why the context of masking matters to the person making that choice.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Sean's explanation of polyvagal theory and how he applies it in therapy.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Exploring both internal distress and external conditions rather than assuming one explanation.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Food, sleep, shelter, sensory needs, and readiness for therapeutic work.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Approaching body awareness gradually when it feels difficult or overwhelming.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Stimming and movement as possible resources for noticing comfort, relaxation, or joy.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> April's standing-and-swiveling interview setup.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Discussing rumination as an experience someone wants help with—not simply as a diagnostic label.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Feedback-informed treatment and asking whether sessions address the client's priorities.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> What happens when a therapist's interpretation misses the mark.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Apologizing, repairing misunderstandings, and adjusting the work.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Questions to ask a prospective therapist about disagreement and feedback.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Supporting someone's regulation without trying to manage every aspect of their experience.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Using workbook exercises selectively while recognizing the role of their wider context.

About the Guest
Sean Inderbitzen is an autistic psychotherapist and author who writes for W. W. Norton about autism and applications of polyvagal theory. In this interview, he discusses Neural Exercises for Autism, his earlier work, and how personal experience has informed his approach to therapy.
His discussion emphasizes curiosity, the therapeutic relationship, client feedback, and exploring what supports a person's wellbeing in their own circumstances. He describes applied neural exercises as tools for bringing mindful attention to bodily experience and exploring flexibility and connection.
Sean directs listeners to his books through major retailers and to Instagram and LinkedIn to follow his work or ask questions. Search his name as Sean Inderbitzen; confirm exact profile links before adding them to the published show notes.
Key Takeaways
p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Progress should relate to the person's own goals—not automatically to appearing less autistic.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> A supportive therapeutic relationship leaves room for correction and disagreement.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Body-awareness practices should be approached with attention to comfort, choice, and pacing.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Movement someone already enjoys can be a starting point for noticing what feels helpful.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Sensory conditions and basic needs belong in conversations about distress.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> A therapist's personal experience is not a substitute for understanding the client's experience.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Repair includes acknowledging when an interpretation was invalidating and changing course.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Tools are possibilities to explore—not promises that every person will respond the same way

 
Connect with Gary Coulton
Continue the conversation about neurodivergence, self-understanding, and everyday wisdom:
p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> The Positive Echo on Substack — Gary's weekly essays on making wiser decisions a little more often.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Gary on LinkedIn — Writing and conversations about wisdom, neurodivergence, clarity, and purpose.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Gary's author website — His background, memoir, and reader reflections.

Gary's Books
Wisdomize: See Clearly. Decide Wisely. Live Fully.
"A self-help book for people who hate being told what to do."
Gary describes Wisdomize as a concise, practical guide for reflective adults who want to think more clearly, connect with their values, and make decisions with greater purpose and integrity.
Rather than prescribing one correct way to live, the book offers invitations to reflect, notice, and explore your own responses.
Available for preorder from October 12, 2026, according to Gary's supplied promotional information.
Explore or preorder Wisdomize
Reader endorsement supplied by Gary:
"What I really like about Wisdomize is that it's not just another book telling you how to improve yourself. It actually gives you practical tools and exercises to help you reflect, make better decisions and take ownership of your own personal development."
— Owen Williams, Co-Founder of Six Red Squares
 
 

Demons to Champions: How I Fell in Love with My Neurodivergent Maverick Mind
Gary's memoir explores his internal and external worlds: professional achievement, feeling different, self-criticism, relationships, and learning to understand his neurodivergent mind. He describes it as a book for misfits and left-field thinkers—and for the people who love, work with, or lead them.garycoulton.co
Explore Demons to Champions
A reader's reflection:
"A compelling read, a beautifully written book which made me laugh and cry."
— Reader review featured on Gary's author website.garycoulton.co
 
 

Updated Episode Description Closing
Continue exploring the ideas from this conversation through Gary's memoir, Demons to Champions: How I Fell in Love with My Neurodivergent Maverick Mind, and his practical guide, Wisdomize: See Clearly. Decide Wisely. Live Fully.
For weekly reflections on making wiser decisions, visit The Positive Echo on Substack. Direct links to Gary's books, website, and LinkedIn are in the show notes.
 
You do not need another voice telling you everything you should be doing.
Gary Coulton's Wisdomize takes a different approach: practical reflection, everyday noticing, and questions that help you explore what matters to you.
His memoir, Demons to Champions, shares the personal journey behind that work—from self-criticism toward a kinder relationship with his neurodivergent mind.
📖 Wisdomize: https://mybook.to/wisdomize
📖 Demons to Champions: https://mybook.to/demonstochampions
✍️ The Positive Echo: https://garycoulton.substack.com/

What does helpful therapy look like when the goal is not simply more eye contact, fewer autistic traits, or appearing more comfortable than you actually feel?
In this episode of Adulting with Autism, I talk with autistic psychotherapist and author Sean Inderbitzen about feeling stuck, rumination, body awareness, connection, and the importance of having a real voice in your own care.
Sean introduces the approach he calls applied neural exercises: practices that invite curiosity and nonjudgmental attention to bodily experience. We discuss his use of polyvagal theory as a therapeutic framework, while exploring a broader question: what does this particular person want help with, and how will we know whether the support is working?
We also talk about masking in context, sensory environments, basic needs, and why an approach that helps one person may not fit another. During the conversation, I demonstrate the movement I use while interviewing—and we notice what happens when I pay attention to how it feels.
One of the most useful questions from the episode is one you can bring to a prospective therapist:
"How do you respond when a client tells you that you're wrong?"
Because support should include room to disagree, correct a misunderstanding, change direction, and say when something is not helping.
Content note: This conversation includes grief, trauma, and brief discussion of suicidal thoughts and a potentially distressing clinical example.
In This Episode, We Cover
p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Sean's experience as an autistic psychotherapist and author.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Why he wishes autism had been discussed more openly earlier in his life.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> The personal vulnerability involved in writing about his own experience.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> What he means by "neural exercises."

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Flexibility and connection as individualized goals—not universal demands.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Looking at wellbeing across a person's relationship with themselves, close relationships, wider social life, and life overall.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Why the context of masking matters to the person making that choice.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Sean's explanation of polyvagal theory and how he applies it in therapy.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Exploring both internal distress and external conditions rather than assuming one explanation.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Food, sleep, shelter, sensory needs, and readiness for therapeutic work.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Approaching body awareness gradually when it feels difficult or overwhelming.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Stimming and movement as possible resources for noticing comfort, relaxation, or joy.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> April's standing-and-swiveling interview setup.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Discussing rumination as an experience someone wants help with—not simply as a diagnostic label.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Feedback-informed treatment and asking whether sessions address the client's priorities.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> What happens when a therapist's interpretation misses the mark.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Apologizing, repairing misunderstandings, and adjusting the work.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Questions to ask a prospective therapist about disagreement and feedback.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Supporting someone's regulation without trying to manage every aspect of their experience.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Using workbook exercises selectively while recognizing the role of their wider context.

About the Guest
Sean Inderbitzen is an autistic psychotherapist and author who writes for W. W. Norton about autism and applications of polyvagal theory. In this interview, he discusses Neural Exercises for Autism, his earlier work, and how personal experience has informed his approach to therapy.
His discussion emphasizes curiosity, the therapeutic relationship, client feedback, and exploring what supports a person's wellbeing in their own circumstances. He describes applied neural exercises as tools for bringing mindful attention to bodily experience and exploring flexibility and connection.
Sean directs listeners to his books through major retailers and to Instagram and LinkedIn to follow his work or ask questions. Search his name as Sean Inderbitzen; confirm exact profile links before adding them to the published show notes.
Key Takeaways
p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Progress should relate to the person's own goals—not automatically to appearing less autistic.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> A supportive therapeutic relationship leaves room for correction and disagreement.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Body-awareness practices should be approached with attention to comfort, choice, and pacing.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Movement someone already enjoys can be a starting point for noticing what feels helpful.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Sensory conditions and basic needs belong in conversations about distress.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> A therapist's personal experience is not a substitute for understanding the client's experience.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Repair includes acknowledging when an interpretation was invalidating and changing course.

p]:pt-0 [&>p]:mb-2 [&>p]:my-0"> Tools are possibilities to explore—not promises that every person will respond the same wa