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The Way Out Is In

Podcast The Way Out Is In
Plum Village
This podcast series is aimed at helping us to transcend our fear and anger so that we can be more engaged in the world in a way that develops love and compassio...
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5 of 82
  • Feel It to Heal It: The Dharma of Music (Episode #79)
    Welcome to episode 79 of The Way Out Is In: The Zen Art of Living, a podcast series mirroring Zen Master Thich Nhat Hanh’s deep teachings of Buddhist philosophy: a simple yet profound methodology for dealing with our suffering, and for creating more happiness and joy in our lives. In this installment, Zen Buddhist monk Brother Phap Huu and leadership coach/journalist Jo Confino are joined by musician/producer Jack Peñate and frequent guest Brother Phap Linh, Dharma teacher/musician. Together, they talk about the release of A Cloud Never Dies, the debut album by the Plum Village Band – a musical meditation on love, continuation, and non-fear, inspired by and dedicated to Thich Nhat Hanh.The album was produced by Jack, with the two monastics joining the conversation as co-creators of the album and representing the Plum Village Band: a collective of Zen Buddhist monks and nuns from Plum Village Monastery, France, plus musician-meditator friends from around the world. In the first part of the episode, the guests discuss their musical journeys, from childhood to this point; the power of music as a portal to share the Dharma; music and Buddhist tradition; making music as a spiritual form; art as a Zen practice; and more.In the second part, they share songs from the album and discuss their origins, meaning, creative process, and production stories. And we get to listen to the discussed songs too. Listen to the album and find out more about it here. Co-produced by the Plum Village App:https://plumvillage.app/ And Global Optimism:https://globaloptimism.com/ With support from the Thich Nhat Hanh Foundation:https://thichnhathanhfoundation.org/ List of resources Interbeinghttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interbeing Jack Peñatehttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jack_Pe%C3%B1ate Brother Phap Linh (Brother Spirit)https://www.instagram.com/brotherspiritSister Chan Khonghttps://plumvillage.org/about/sister-chan-khong  ‘Recommendation’https://plumvillage.org/articles/recommendation Album: A Cloud Never Dieshttps://plumvillage.org/album-a-cloud-never-dies The Way Out Is In: ‘Regeneration and Musical Inspiration: The North American Tour (Episode #53)’https://plumvillage.org/podcast/regeneration-and-musical-inspiration-the-north-american-tour-episode-53 Pirates Blendhttps://piratesblend.com/ ‘The Four Dharma Seals of Plum Village’https://plumvillage.org/articles/the-four-dharma-seals-of-plum-village Aretha Franklinhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aretha_Franklin Billie Holidayhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Billie_Holiday Lee ‘Scratch’ Perry https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lee_%22Scratch%22_Perry Narcissus and Goldmundhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Narcissus_and_GoldmundThe Glass Bead Gamehttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Glass_Bead_GameHermann Hessehttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hermann_Hesse Bhagavad Gitahttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bhagavad_Gita Quotes “Music and Zen go together.” “There’s art in making tea and there’s art in life, in the way that we live our days.” “The highest music, the best kind of music, is breathing.” “Everything could become practice. It just depends on our heart and our intention. We feel like we can be very authentic practitioners and teachers of mindfulness and meditation and combine that with playing music, singing, creating. Because our teacher showed us how to do that, and how to be real in the doing of that, to make the music a meditation as well.”“Music not as a performance, but as an invitation to touch the present moment.” “When you know what your path is, you have to completely follow that, and be completely aligned with your intuition and your instinct about that.” “Harmony isn’t something that you’re always in, but it’s something you’re always striving for.”“You deal with the desire for fame by finding a deeper desire, one that’s more important to you. And then you can handle the other one, and the desire for fame looks silly in comparison. That’s a practice that people can do together. And it’s a discipline. And it’s a way of life. And that’s what I love about it. But what I’m interested in is how we get aligned in our purpose and aspiration. And are there things that we can actually do as practices?” “Music as an offering. We’re not doing this to be known, to make money, to be famous, to be successful, to do any of these things. We’re doing it to connect with the suffering that’s in the world, with the struggle that’s in us in relation to that suffering. The struggle of, ‘How do I help?’ When we see the strife, the pain, the killing, the destruction of humans – humans by humans and humans of ecosystems, of the beauty and diversity of the Earth – for me, it’s incredibly painful and there’s a feeling of, ‘How can I respond?’ How can I use what I have to try to help in some way, to alleviate some of the pain, to make things a little bit better for somebody, somewhere? And, as a musician, I do feel that music’s relevant to that somehow.” “I really feel like we can’t make the more beautiful world that our hearts know is possible without music. Music is going to be part of it. Music is going to give us the courage to do it; the fearlessness, the vision. It’s going to help us to keep coming back to our vulnerability, to stay honest with ourselves when we get into pride.” “You have to feel it to heal it. If we don’t feel our pain, then there’s no hope for us to embrace it, to understand it, to transform it, to look deeply into it. So it starts with feeling it. And music, I think, really can get past all of our psychological defenses, our armor, and our intellectual reasons and justifications and explanations and rationalizations; it can cut to the heart of the matter, which is the heart, and take you right there. And suddenly you find yourself feeling things that, maybe, without the music, it wouldn’t feel safe to feel.” “There was no difference, at a certain point, between composing and praying and crying and healing.”
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  • Being with Busyness Q&A, Part Two (Episode #78)
    Welcome to episode 78 of The Way Out Is In: The Zen Art of Living, a podcast series mirroring Zen Master Thich Nhat Hanh’s deep teachings of Buddhist philosophy: a simple yet profound methodology for dealing with our suffering, and for creating more happiness and joy in our lives.This special episode – part two of two Q&A installments – marks the launch of the first book by Zen Buddhist monk Brother Phap Huu and leadership coach/journalist Jo Confino. Being with Busyness: Zen Ways to Transform Overwhelm and Burnout is intended to help readers navigate these experiences, relieve stress, and reconnect to their inner joy through mindfulness and compassion practices inspired by Thich Nhat Hanh.  Instead of discussing the book, the two presenters asked listeners to submit their questions on these timely topics. Listeners’ generous, vulnerable questions answered in this episode include: What are some practical tips for staying grounded and mindful amidst the busyness? How can I get back into practicing mindfulness? How can I practice mindfulness while doing multiple things at once? How can I be of service to others while still caring for myself? How can busy people know when it’s enough and draw a line? How does Plum Village deal with the burnout issues that also exist in the outside world? Co-produced by the Plum Village App:https://plumvillage.app/   And Global Optimism:https://globaloptimism.com/ With support from the Thich Nhat Hanh Foundation:https://thichnhathanhfoundation.org/ List of resources Interbeinghttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interbeing Being with Busyness https://www.parallax.org/product/being-with-busyness The Way Out Is In: ‘Being with Busyness Q&A, Part One (Episode #77)’https://plumvillage.org/podcast/being-with-busyness-qa-part-one-episode-77 The Miracle of Mindfulness: An Introduction to the Practice of Meditationhttps://www.parallax.org/product/the-miracle-of-mindfulness Pema Chödrönhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pema_Ch%C3%B6dr%C3%B6n Start Where You Arehttps://pemachodronfoundation.org/product/start-where-you-are-book/ Sister Chan Khonghttps://plumvillage.org/about/sister-chan-khong ‘Three Resources Explaining the Plum Village Tradition of Lazy Days’https://plumvillage.app/three-resources-explaining-the-plum-village-tradition-of-lazy-days/ Dharma Talks: ‘The Fours Pillars of Spiritual Life’https://plumvillage.org/library/dharma-talks/the-four-pillars-of-spiritual-life-dharma-talk-by-sr-dang-nghiem Bodhisattvahttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bodhisattva Quotes “The Buddha explains that each and every one of us has an island within us that we have to tend and take care of. That island is our way of being, our calm that we can bring to the chaos. And it doesn’t mean that our surroundings are calm, but that we are calm inside. Even just a slice of calmness can relieve everything that is happening around us.” “The art of a meditator among busyness is to not be dispersed or carried away. When we are dispersed and carried away, we have the ability to come back to that island of practice. And this is an ongoing practice that we can all develop. We develop it when we’re at peace, when we have calm, when there is stillness.”  “Our mindfulness is what we’re cultivating in our mind at the present moment.” “When you’re washing your plate, that is a moment when you’re just washing your plate, not thinking about the next project; that is mindfulness.” “The spiritual dimension is an old technology. It’s free and can be practiced from day one, right now, right here.” “Letting go in the space of Dharma is to grow and to have freedom. But if we’re to let go, to give up, that’s a different energy. So we also have to know that taking a step back to have more space, and then continuing, is also okay.” “People have dual problems. One is that they have self-loathing; the other is that they wish for perfectionism. In other words, not only do we not feel we’re enough, but we often don’t like ourselves. And then, on the other end of the spectrum, we’re trying to be perfect. That is the perfect storm for overwhelm and burnout.” “A hungry ghost: never satisfied and always desperate.” “The idea that there is a perfection to mindfulness is a wrong view because it doesn’t embrace the insight of non-duality: that suffering and happiness lean on each other. So imperfection and perfection play their part in life, in meditation, in love, in joy, and in community.” “Two people can share the same bed, but if they don’t share the same dreams then there’s no foundation for that relationship.” “When your generosity is no longer there and you don’t have any more to give, you have to rebuild. So the Buddha teaches that we have to learn to take care of the island within us. We have to know how to understand our capacity; this is very difficult.” “Being able to witness what’s going on in the world and also maintain our own sense of love, self-love, and love for the world is so important.” “The work of temples is never done.”
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  • Being with Busyness Q&A, Part One (Episode #77)
    Welcome to episode 77 of The Way Out Is In: The Zen Art of Living, a podcast series mirroring Zen Master Thich Nhat Hanh’s deep teachings of Buddhist philosophy: a simple yet profound methodology for dealing with our suffering, and for creating more happiness and joy in our lives. This special episode – part one of a two Q&A installments – marks the launch of the first book by Zen Buddhist monk Brother Phap Huu and leadership coach/journalist Jo Confino. Being with Busyness: Zen Ways to Transform Overwhelm and Burnout is intended to help readers navigate these experiences, relieve stress, and reconnect to their inner joy through mindfulness and compassion practices inspired by Zen Master Thich Nhat Hanh. Instead of discussing the book, the two presenters asked listeners to submit their questions on these timely topics. Listeners’ generous, vulnerable questions answered in this episode include: Can mindfulness help us observe busyness, set limits, and let us savor boredom and solitude? How do you handle the phone as monastics in Plum Village, and what do you do to not get pulled in? How can I make long-lasting change when our culture demands constant attention? How do I survive when I desperately want to leave my line of work but can’t for financial reasons?  Co-produced by the Plum Village App:https://plumvillage.app/   And Global Optimism:https://globaloptimism.com/ With support from the Thich Nhat Hanh Foundation:https://thichnhathanhfoundation.org/ List of resources Interbeinghttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interbeing Being with Busyness https://www.parallax.org/product/being-with-busyness ‘Three Resources Explaining the Plum Village Tradition of Lazy Days’https://plumvillage.app/three-resources-explaining-the-plum-village-tradition-of-lazy-days/ Dharma Talks: ‘The Noble Eightfold Path’https://plumvillage.org/library/dharma-talks/the-noble-eightfold-path Online course: Zen and the Art of Saving the Planethttps://plumvillage.org/courses/zen-and-the-art-of-saving-the-planet Bodhisattvahttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bodhisattva Christiana Figuereshttps://www.globaloptimism.com/christiana-figueres Quotes “The title, Being with Busyness: it’s not getting rid of busyness, it’s not fixing busyness, but it is a way of being with busyness. But it’s not about fixing it, it’s about how to be in it and how to be with it; how to move through these particular strong energies of our society so that we don’t lose ourselves.”“The first wing of meditation is the art of stopping and recognizing the present moment. But there is a fear of doing nothing, because we have been educated – dare I say, brainwashed – to think that we have to do something in every moment of life, because time is money. Time is projects; time is to succeed. And this has driven our society into a mindset of not knowing how to be in the now.” “Thay always reminds us that the purpose of being alive, first and foremost, is to be here, to know what is happening in the very here and now.” “Knowing that we have habits that are taking us away from the present moment is already mindfulness.” “A mindful life, the art of mindfulness, is not about just cutting off bad habits; it’s also about developing enough good habits to replace the bad ones.” “I really love this idea of reciprocity: the idea that if you’re given something valuable then the most natural thing is to want to give something valuable back.”“It’s not about the laptop. It’s about how we use it; it’s about what kind of practice we build around it.”“There is a system pushing us to be a certain way. There is a system making demands of us – but, actually, within that system we always have agency. There is always something we can do.”“Dwelling happily in the present moment doesn’t mean that that moment needs to be happy for us to be happy – but it is about being happy no matter what.”
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    1:18:46
  • The Four Types of Food for Healthy Growth (Episode #76)
    Welcome to episode 76 of The Way Out Is In: The Zen Art of Living, a podcast series mirroring Zen Master Thich Nhat Hanh’s deep teachings of Buddhist philosophy: a simple yet profound methodology for dealing with our suffering, and for creating more happiness and joy in our lives. In this installment, Zen Buddhist monk Brother Phap Huu and leadership coach/journalist Jo Confino put a modern twist on the Four Nutriments – one of the Sutras of the Buddha – using it as a framework to explore what it is to be a mindful consumer of life.  With each of the Four Nutriments – edible foods, sense impressions, volition or aspiration, and consciousness – the Buddha gave a little story which the presenters explore and bring into the reality of our times.The ensuing conversation touches many topics and ideas, like how and why to invest in our spiritual dimension; individual and collective consciousness; shifting consciousness, generating community and a fairer society; practicing moderation; cultivating compassion; habit energies; rebuilding our connection to food; changing the way stories are told; suffering as a bell of mindfulness; and more. Brother Phap Huu shares deeply about experiencing burnout; speaking our minds; and adapting Buddhist teaching for each new generation. Jo complements this episode’s theme with personal stories and a new approach to what it is to be courageous.  Co-produced by the Plum Village App:https://plumvillage.app/   And Global Optimism:https://globaloptimism.com/ With support from the Thich Nhat Hanh Foundation:https://thichnhathanhfoundation.org/ List of resources Online course: Zen and the Art of Saving the Planethttps://plumvillage.org/zasp?utm_source=podcast&utm_medium=twoii&utm_campaign=zasp Interbeinghttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interbeing Sutrashttps://plumvillage.org/genre/sutrasSutras: ‘Discourse on the Four Kinds of Nutriments’https://plumvillage.org/library/sutras/discourse-on-the-four-kinds-of-nutriments Bodhisattvahttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bodhisattva Douglas Tompkinshttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Douglas_Tompkins The Order of Interbeinghttps://plumvillage.org/community/order-of-interbeing John Bellhttps://www.parallax.org/authors/john-bell/ Who Cares Wins: How to Protect the Planet You Lovehttps://www.penguin.co.uk/books/305695/who-cares-wins-by-cole-lily/9780241309148 Quotes “Every being has a spiritual dimension and we need to invest in our spiritual dimension. And if young people can invest in it earlier, then the future has a greater hope and a more wonderful and sustainable livelihood that we can lead ourselves towards.” “Consuming is not just what we eat and drink but what we listen to, what we smell, what we taste, and so on.” “It’s not that wanting a state of peace means that we can suddenly have peace; we have to nurture the peace inside of us.” “Mindfulness gives us the lens of awareness to go inwards and see what we are consuming on a daily basis. What is intentional and what are we consuming that we’re not even aware of?” “Our way of being is also food for elements that are outside of us.” “We’re creating a cacophony of thoughts, feelings, and actions that form an individual basis, then create a collective. Often, people don’t feel that their individual behavior has an impact on the collective; often, they think that the collective is the only thing influencing them.” “Trust the seeds that you plant, but don’t expect them to grow right away.” “The Buddha says every action has an impact on the past, the present, and the future. So our actions today actually have an impact 1,000 years later.” “When we practice a vegetarian or a vegan diet, it is because we are aspiring to cultivate our compassion.” “Vulnerability opens support.” “We know that habit energy is not ours alone: it’s society’s habit, it is our ancestors’ habit. So if we come from a family that has addictions, we know we have addictions in us.” “Once we know where food comes from, our gratitude manifests; it is born. And when you have gratitude, food automatically tastes better.” “The Buddha says that our world is lived by our shared consciousness.” “The work that we are doing in Plum Village is helping, wanting to shift consciousness, and showing that love is possible and that love is there and that peace is action.” “Sense impressions are also teachers. And this is why, for us, the Dharma is not just spoken Dharma, but the way we live, how we show up. That is a sense impression. That is a teaching in itself.” “When it’s all about the money, we lose our ethical compass and we lose our connection; we lose our sense of responsibility and accountability. And if money is the object, then there’s going to be a lot of suffering.” “Why don’t we like good news? Because we’re so conditioned to suffering.” “The Buddha says that we have to reflect and shine our light onto our views, that we are striving towards. And if that view, goal, or aspiration is destroying our well-being, we have to have the courage to walk away.” “Courage is being prepared to not be like everybody else.” “What is our worldview? Are we limited? Are we expanding? I think coming to retreats like Plum Village, or traveling, is so helpful for expanding our consciousness that maybe our way of thinking about what is right is very limited. That’s why, when we learn about ethics, we have to be very open. And in Buddhism, one of the greatest foundations is openness, because what we think is right may be totally different in a different culture. So, consciousness: we have to allow it to expand, be flexible, transform, grow.”
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    1:59:30
  • Bridging Being and Doing (Episode #75)
    Welcome to episode 75 of The Way Out Is In: The Zen Art of Living, a podcast series mirroring Zen Master Thich Nhat Hanh’s deep teachings of Buddhist philosophy: a simple yet profound methodology for dealing with our suffering, and for creating more happiness and joy in our lives. In this installment, Zen Buddhist monk Brother Phap Huu and leadership coach/journalist Jo Confino discuss the practice of being and doing – in terms of both Buddhist and mainstream-society perceptions. Together, they look at practical ways to create conditions in which our way of being present can be truly valued and made essential in all our daily actions. How can we train ourselves to maintain presence, in spite of our circumstances? The conversation tackles various relevant topics, such as being as the ground of our actions; being as a state which is crucial for the art of peace; training our concentration; the super-strength of allowing and sharing our vulnerabilities; creating a schedule for practicing being; how ‘to be’ in Zen and what people can get wrong about it; being as a way to access interbeing; doing as an avoidance of being (what is it about being that scares us?); the risks of not bringing being into doing; and more.The episode ends with a short meditation on being, guided by Brother Phap Huu. Co-produced by the Plum Village App:https://plumvillage.app/   And Global Optimism:https://globaloptimism.com/ With support from the Thich Nhat Hanh Foundation:https://thichnhathanhfoundation.org/ List of resources Online course: Zen and the Art of Saving the Planethttps://plumvillage.org/zasp?utm_source=podcast&utm_medium=twoii&utm_campaign=zasp Interbeinghttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interbeing ‘The Four Dharma Seals of Plum Village’ https://plumvillage.org/articles/the-four-dharma-seals-of-plum-village The Way Out Is In: ‘The Art of Laziness: Don’t Just Do Something, Sit There! (Episode #41)’https://plumvillage.org/podcast/the-art-of-laziness-dont-just-do-something-sit-there-episode-41The Way Out Is In: ‘Taming Our Survival Instinct (Episode #65)’https://plumvillage.org/podcast/taming-our-survival-instinct-episode-65 John Bradshawhttps://www.johnbradshaw.com/ Quotes “Mainstream society seems to believe that action equates to what we do, and how we are and the way we are in the world tends to be relegated to a very, very poor second place.”“In the deep view of Buddhism, ‘being’ can only be when you interbe with everything else.” “To be is to interbe.” “Don’t just do something, sit there.” “We tend to think in terms of doing and not in terms of being. We think that when we are not doing anything, we are wasting our time. That is not true. Our time is, first of all, for us to be. To be what? To be alive, to be peace, to be joy, to be loving. And that is what the world needs the most. So we train ourselves in order to be. And if you know the art of being peace, being silent, then you have the ground for every action, because the ground for action is to be. And the quality of being determines the quality of doing. Action must be based on non-action.” “This mindset of doing and being has been divided. Whereas, in our training we don’t separate between spirituality and doing.” “In Buddhism, our actions – which we leave behind in this world – are our truest karma. They are the true continuation of our thoughts, our speech, and our bodily actions: how I open the door, how I see you, how I speak to you, how I engage in difficult conversations.” “The schedule is our teacher.” “Being can be very confronting because, when we’re truly there, we start to see ourselves more clearly.” “The real art is being blissful and being present through every storm that arises.” “By being and understanding how to be, you can act with integrity and with understanding.” “Don’t try to explain it; be it first.” “The essence of our practice is to develop our quality of being present. Being present is the ground of all actions. But, a lot of the time, we don’t do it with the foundation of right intentions. So when we practice meditation, study the teachings of the Buddha, and really put it into practice, it comes down to becoming more and more present and alive for whatever is present for us.”“We can’t convince people of the importance of being; they have to taste it.”
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