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The Way Out Is In

Podcast The Way Out Is In
Podcast The Way Out Is In

The Way Out Is In

Plum Village
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This podcast series is aimed at helping us to transcend our fear and anger so that we can be more engaged in the world in a way that develops love and compassio... More
This podcast series is aimed at helping us to transcend our fear and anger so that we can be more engaged in the world in a way that develops love and compassio... More

Available Episodes

5 of 53
  • Be Beautiful, Be Yourself (Episode #50)
    Welcome to episode 50 of The Way Out Is In: The Zen Art of Living, a podcast series mirroring Zen Master Thich Nhat Hanh’s deep teachings of Buddhist philosophy: a simple yet profound methodology for dealing with our suffering, and for creating more happiness and joy in our lives. In this episode, Zen Buddhist monk Brother Phap Huu and leadership coach and journalist Jo Confino contemplate how to find compassion for ourselves – even when we feel stuck and unable to move forward, and know what to do but enter self-loathing rather than self-compassion. Together, they discuss what it is to love ourselves and what a difference it can make. Plus, why is it so difficult to change? What should we be mindful of? And what is love to us?  Brother Phap Huu further considers how helpful insights can blossom; attaining new views of growth in spirituality; unconditional love; what it is to be stuck and how to unstick ourselves; ‘striving’ energy, perceptions, and aspirations; creating new stories; and acceptance.Jo starts with a confession before sharing about epiphanies; times when one’s story is more important than one’s happiness; self-worth; cultivating change at the edges; and mindful reminders. The episode ends with a short meditation guided by Brother Phap Huu. Enjoy! Co-produced by the Plum Village App:https://plumvillage.app/ And Global Optimism:https://globaloptimism.com/  With support from the Thich Nhat Hanh Foundation:https://thichnhathanhfoundation.org/  List of resources  Sister True Dedicationhttps://plumvillage.org/people/dharma-teachers/sister-hien-nghiem/  ‘Tangerine Meditation’https://plumvillage.org/library/clips/tangerine-meditation/ Sister Jinahttps://plumvillage.org/people/dharma-teachers/sr-dieu-nghiem/  Saṃsārahttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sa%E1%B9%83s%C4%81ra_(Buddhism)  Krishna Dashttps://www.krishnadas.com/  The Miracle of Mindfulnesshttps://plumvillage.org/books/the-miracle-of-mindfulness/  The Heart of the Buddha’s Teachinghttps://plumvillage.org/books/the-heart-of-the-buddhas-teaching/  Dharma Talks: ‘True Love and the Four Noble Truths’https://plumvillage.org/library/dharma-talks/true-love-and-the-four-noble-truths/  The Four Noble Truthshttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dy-RI3FrdGA  Dharma Talks: ‘The Noble Eightfold Path’https://plumvillage.org/library/dharma-talks/the-noble-eightfold-path/  Quotes “Peace in oneself, peace in the world.”  “When I know that I don’t hate myself, love is already there. And acceptance is a part of love.”  “Mindfulness is the opposite of forgetfulness, and love is the opposite of hatred.” “After one of Thich Nhat Hanh’s talks, I said, ‘Sister Jina, don’t you monastics get bored of Thay repeating the same thing over and over again? And doesn’t Thay get bored with repeating the same teachings over and over again?’ And she turned to me and said, ‘But do we practice?’” “Because of our unmindful society, where there’s more forgetfulness and not enough awareness, love becomes something to gain. People are trying to gain love rather than to cultivate love within them, creating a lot of expectation around it. And when there is love, there is already a need. But in the practice of Buddhism, and in our practice, love should be unconditional.” “Our practice is to understand that love is a growing organic energy. But hatred is also an organic energy. So the first practice in mindfulness and in Buddhism has to start with oneself. And maybe that is the most painful start because, for some reason, it’s easier to love others.”  “Mindfulness is light. Forgetfulness is the darkness. But the two rely on each other and can dance within each other.”  “If you have an empty bowl, then you’ve got nothing to give. All you really want to do is fill your own bowl. But when your bowl is full and overflowing, it naturally leads to generosity.”  “In my own life, the moments of greatest transformation have been when I’ve stopped long enough for an insight to arise; what I refer to as an epiphany.”  “New forms of life tend to grow at the very edges of ecosystems, like the edges of estuaries where new life forms have space to develop. If they develop and get enough strength, then they come towards the center and become an established lifeform. And they sometimes become what can’t change. Then something else will grow at the edge and come into the center.”  “The Buddha said that we always have to check our perception of our reality and the reality that we want to achieve. And this is very different from aspiration.” “To look into the past is also to educate, to learn, and to have insight. So insight comes from awareness, and we have to have baby insight to have big insight.” “Thay says sometimes our habits, our energies, are there for us to reflect on. If I don’t have striving energy, then maybe I don’t have any aspirations.” 
    11/05/2023
    1:18:55
  • Freedom (Episode #49)
    Welcome to episode 49 of The Way Out Is In: The Zen Art of Living, a podcast series mirroring Zen Master Thich Nhat Hanh’s deep teachings of Buddhist philosophy: a simple yet profound methodology for dealing with our suffering, and for creating more happiness and joy in our lives. This time, Zen Buddhist monk Brother Phap Huu and journalist Jo Confino discuss freedom, exploring a deeper meaning of what it is to be free through a focus on freedom as approached in Buddhism and the Plum Village tradition: something associated with responsibility and commitment. So, what are we trying to be free from? They further delve into how one can become free within a monastery; liberating moments; working with energy levels; suffering and freedom; collective energy; redefining spaciousness; and letting go of busyness. And how did Thay express freedom in his life and in his practice?  The episode ends with a short meditation on freedom guided by Brother Phap Huu. Enjoy! Co-produced by the Plum Village App:https://plumvillage.app/ And Global Optimism:https://globaloptimism.com/  With support from the Thich Nhat Hanh Foundation:https://thichnhathanhfoundation.org/  List of resources  Bhikṣuhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bhikkhu  Filial pietyhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Filial_piety  ‘The Fourteen Precepts of Engaged Buddhism’https://www.lionsroar.com/the-fourteen-precepts-of-engaged-buddhism/  Rains Retreat 2023-24https://plumvillage.org/retreats/info/rains-retreat-2023/  Sister Chan Khonghttps://plumvillage.org/about/sister-chan-khong/  Freedom Wherever We Gohttps://plumvillage.org/books/freedom-wherever-we-go/  ‘The Four Dharma Seals of Plum Village’https://plumvillage.org/articles/the-four-dharma-seals-of-plum-village/  Quotes “Coming back to the simple pleasures of life is freedom” “Freedom is commitment. This idea that we’re free if we can do anything we want is not freedom. But when we really commit to something, give ourselves wholeheartedly to it, then actually that is freedom.”  “When we look at ourselves and we say, ‘I want to be me’, who is this ‘me’? This ‘me’ suddenly becomes an object. And if we look into our present moment, can we truly be just ourself?” “In Buddhism and in our practice of mindfulness, whenever we speak about something such as freedom, it’s always ‘freedom of something’. What is it that we are trying to be free from?” “We are speaking about freedom of our suffering, freedom of our negativity, freedom of how we want to walk and show up in this world. Our steps can be made of the energy of freedom and ease. Our breath can generate the sense of happiness, liberation in the present moment, which is freedom. And we understand that freedom is something that we can touch in the present moment, even if we are sitting in a prison.” “We are doing whatever we want. But are we truly free from the past? Are we free from daydreaming about the present moment? Are we free from being worried about the future? Are we free in our thinking? So freedom is always freedom of something. And our practice is to learn to walk and step into freedom each day.” “We can be in pain, but also be free from it by experiencing it, accepting it, and working through it. So freedom is not a destination very far away; it can be experienced through our practice of mindfulness. And freedom comes with responsibility: when we say something, it has consequences. When we act, it has consequences. So freedom can be cultivated, it can be experienced, but it can also be taken away.”  “Meditation is not a competition.”  “We will continue to be free in our doing.”  “Freedom is not singular; it is not just about my freedom or your freedom: if I give you your freedom, I give myself my freedom. That freedom is not separated into one person.” “When we have fear, that is when we lose our freedom.”
    27/04/2023
    1:12:44
  • Humility in Service to Life (Episode #48)
    Welcome to episode 48 of The Way Out Is In: The Zen Art of Living, a podcast series mirroring Zen Master Thich Nhat Hanh’s deep teachings of Buddhist philosophy: a simple yet profound methodology for dealing with our suffering, and for creating more happiness and joy in our lives. This instalment marks the first time the two presenters have recorded separately, with Zen Buddhist monk Brother Phap Huu in Thay’s Sitting Still Hut in Plum Village France, and journalist Jo Confino at the Garrison Institute, New York.  Speaking from two different continents, they explore fame and humility. What price do we pay for our fame-obsessed societies? Can humility become a great power? How do we show up in the world? What is it ‘to be enough’ in the world? And how did Thay handle fame and other famous people?These dimensions are discussed with help from Buddhist teachings, Thich Nhat Hanh’s practices, and the presenters’ personal life stories, giving us a flavor of experiences of fame, but also the power of humility in service to life.      Brother Phap Huu further delves into inferiority, superiority, and equality complexes; openness and insight; unconditional presence; humility in learning and being; simplicity; curiosity; Thay’s bodhisattva energy; and honoring blood and spiritual ancestors. And how is Brother Phap Huu coping with… feline fame? Jo muses about humility in leadership; the power of leading from the middle; responsible journalism; ‘un-cultivating’ fame; looking inwards and outwards with humility; fame as another form of extraction; and more. The episode ends with a short meditation guided by Brother Phap Huu. Co-produced by the Plum Village App:https://plumvillage.app/ And Global Optimism:https://globaloptimism.com/  With support from the Thich Nhat Hanh Foundation:https://thichnhathanhfoundation.org/  List of resources  The Garrison Institute https://www.garrisoninstitute.org/  Dharma Talks: ‘The Power of Understanding – Transformation of Manas’https://plumvillage.org/library/dharma-talks/the-power-of-understanding-transformation-of-manas-dharma-talk-by-sr-tue-nghiem-2018-08-02/  Dharma Talks: ‘The Face of Manas Revealed: Understanding a Hidden Aspect of Our Consciousness’https://plumvillage.org/library/dharma-talks/live-dharma-talk-by-sister-tue-nghiem-2020-11-29-plum-village/ Parallax Presshttps://www.parallax.org/  The Happy Farmhttps://thehappyfarm.org/  The Order of Interbeing (OI)https://orderofinterbeing.org/  The International Union for Conservation of Nature (IUCN)https://www.iucn.org/our-union/iucn-world-conservation-congress  Plum Village Thailandhttps://plumvillage.org/practice-centre/plum-village-thailand/  The Four Dharma Seals of Plum Villagehttps://plumvillage.org/articles/the-four-dharma-seals-of-plum-village/  Dharma Rain, and Being Alone (short teaching video by Thich Nhat Hanh)https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cYmON_ElwMw  Quotes “Humility represents openness for us to enter into a spiritual path or into anything that we want to grow. We need an element of openness, of humility. It means we have to humble our ego. We have to let go of our knowledge. We have to come in with open eyes and open ears and an open mind and an open heart in order to truly allow our understanding to grow deeper.”  “As human beings, we’re very curious. And when we block off our curiosity, we’re blocking off some deep resonance in us that wants to know more, wants to expand our knowledge and our awareness.” “Humility is learning to look with fresh eyes, listen with fresh ears, and continuing to expand our hearts and knowing, ‘How can we know everything?’ There’s so much insight and so much wisdom alive around us, not just among the people, among our teachers, among our mentors, among this community – but we also [need to] learn to open ourselves to the environment, to nature.” “Service is a way of expressing love. Therefore, humility is also an expression of love, an expression of giving.” “You can be a victim of your success, but you would never be a victim of your happiness.” “Go as a river.”  “One thing that we can always grow and develop is our heart; it’s our capacity for love and our capacity for being there for others.”  “We all make our own contribution and everyone’s contribution is based on everyone else’s; we are a constellation of change. We’re all making a small mark on the world.” “There’s a humility to recognizing one’s skills or what one can offer and not be caught striving for ‘I need to be better at this’, ‘I need to be better at that’. Recognizing who we are and not feeling we need to be more than that.”  “Our greatest offering, I always come back to, is kindness, openness, and the way of being.” “Have the extraordinary in the ordinary, and the ordinary in the extraordinary.”
    06/04/2023
    1:41:41
  • Love Is the Answer: An Interview with Zen Master Thich Nhat Hanh (Episode #47)
    Welcome to episode 47 of The Way Out Is In: The Zen Art of Living, a podcast series mirroring Zen Master Thich Nhat Hanh’s deep teachings of Buddhist philosophy: a simple yet profound methodology for dealing with our suffering, and for creating more happiness and joy in our lives. This special episode features a precious recording of Thich Nhat Hanh which was previously thought lost. Dating from 2012, it documents an interview journalist Jo Confino conducted with the Zen master in Plum Village’s Toadskin Hut. (Though since remastered, be aware that some background noise remains.)  The conversation covers a wide range of absorbing topics, from the environment, climate change, and civilizational collapse to consumerism, the simple life, 70 years of practicing mindfulness, new Buddhism, passing on, and sangha as continuation.  The recording is introduced by Zen Buddhist monk Brother Phap Huu and Jo Confino, who provide details about the context of the interview and the significance of certain places, people, and events which are mentioned.“Thay is relaxed, insightful, open, and being Thay at his very best.”Enjoy! Co-produced by the Plum Village App:https://plumvillage.app/ And Global Optimism:https://globaloptimism.com/  With support from the Thich Nhat Hanh Foundation:https://thichnhathanhfoundation.org/  List of resources  ‘The Toadskin Hut and Paths of Legend’https://plumvillage.org/about/thich-nhat-hanh/letters/the-toadskin-hut-and-paths-of-legend/  ‘Our Hamlets’https://plumvillage.org/about/plum-village/hamlet/  Outrage + Optimismhttps://www.outrageandoptimism.org/  Brother Phap Linhhttps://plumvillage.org/people/dharma-teachers/brother-phap-linh/  Brother Phap Laihttps://plumvillage.org/people/dharma-teachers/br-phap-lai/  ‘Bat Nha: The Indestructible Seed of Awakening’https://plumvillage.org/about/thich-nhat-hanh/letters/bat-nha-the-seed-of-awakening/  Rains Retreat 2023-24https://plumvillage.org/retreats/info/rains-retreat-2023/  Plum Village International Center in Thailandhttps://plumvillage.org/practice-centre/plum-village-thailand/  ‘New Contemplations before Eating’https://plumvillage.org/articles/news/new-contemplations-before-eating/  Mahatma Gandhihttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mahatma_Gandhi  Hurricane Sandyhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hurricane_Sandy  Stupashttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stupa  Marahttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mara_(demon)  ‘The Five Mindfulness Trainings’https://plumvillage.org/mindfulness/the-5-mindfulness-trainings/  40 Years of Plum Village: ‘Dharma Lamp Transmission during the 40 Years of Plum Village Retreat (June 11-12, 2022)’https://plumvillage.org/articles/dharma-lamp-transmission-during-the-40-years-of-plum-village-retreat-june-11-12-2022/  Shambhala Sun/Lion’s Roarhttps://www.lionsroar.com/shambhala-sun-is-changing-its-name-to-lions-roar-2/  ‘Plum Village Practice in Vietnam – Some Background’https://plumvillage.org/articles/blog/monastic/plum-village-vietnam-background/  Quotes “Love has no frontier.” “When you are grateful, you are happy.” “Why should they have the courage to think about the suffering of the Earth or the environment? They try not to think about it, like a camel who doesn’t want to realize that there’s a lion ahead, so they’re just looking to the sand in order to see only the sand. So that is the attitude of men; we are afraid, we don’t want to see the truth.”  “Thay sent a message to the root temple [Tu Hieu Temple] saying, ‘You should not build a stupa for Thay, because Thay is continued out here.’ One person has already built a temple for Thay in Hanoi, so I reminded them to make the inscription outside, on the front: ‘I am not in here.’ And then if people don’t understand, you add a second sentence: ‘I’m not out there either.’ And if they still don’t understand, add the third and the last sentence: ‘I may be found, maybe in your way of breathing or walking. I’m not in here.’ The root temple has received that message. I said I don’t want to waste the land of the temple in order to build me a stupa. Don’t put me in a small pot in there; I don’t want to continue like that. It’s better to put the ash outside to help the trees to grow. That is the meditation.” “It’s not true that I will die one day, because I have already died many times. And you die every moment and you are reborn in every moment.” “The foundation of your happiness is understanding and love. So if you have that insight and you live by that insight, you will not be fearful anymore.”  “We are happy because we are able to have the Buddha and to renew his teachings. He’s deeply misunderstood by many people, so we try to make the teachings available and simple enough so that people, all people, can make good use of that teaching and practice.”  “Taking a walk and nourishing yourself never harmed anyone.” “And if this body has 100 years’ mortality, Thay will continue to practice, to learn how to love better, to understand better; there’s no limit to the practice. And I think that is true of the human race: we can continue to learn, generation after generation. And I think it’s time for us to begin to learn how to love in non-discriminative ways. Because we are intelligent enough, but we are not loving enough as a race, as a species.”  “I think our perception of time may help, because for us, it [the climate crisis] is a very alarming notion – but if Mother Earth suffers, she knows that she has the power to heal herself. If needed, she will take one hundred million years to heal herself. But for us, we think that our time on Earth is only 100 years, and that is why we are impatient. But I think the collective karma, the collective ignorance, anger, and violence of our race, will lead to our destruction.”
    23/03/2023
    1:30:25
  • Healthy Boundaries (Episode #46)
    Welcome to episode 46 of The Way Out Is In: The Zen Art of Living, a podcast series mirroring Zen Master Thich Nhat Hanh’s deep teachings of Buddhist philosophy: a simple yet profound methodology for dealing with our suffering, and for creating more happiness and joy in our lives. This time, Zen Buddhist monk Brother Phap Huu and journalist Jo Confino talk about healthy boundaries. In this busy and complex world is it possible to remain open and vulnerable whilst also ensuring our safety and protection? This question is answered via stories from the Buddha’s time and Thich Nhat Hanh’s life and teachings, as well as from the presenters’ own life experiences.    Brother Phap Huu further shares about practicing awareness; the two protectors: the warrior and the bodhisattva; teaching and the importance of understanding those you teach; deep listening and loving speech; friendships that end and being OK with someone not loving us; setting boundaries with people who have passed away; and creating a bodhisattva heart. Also, if there’s no self, why are we protecting it? Jo shares about courage and communication; speaking the truth; protecting ourselves from abusive behavior; loving people from a distance; change and shifting boundaries; and the power of presence.The episode ends with a short meditation guided by Brother Phap Huu. Co-produced by the Plum Village App:https://plumvillage.app/ And Global Optimism:https://globaloptimism.com/  With support from the Thich Nhat Hanh Foundation:https://thichnhathanhfoundation.org/  List of resources  Bodhisattvahttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bodhisattva  Bhikkhuhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BhikkhuMahāyānahttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mahayana  Classes: ‘Right Diligence’https://plumvillage.org/library/classes/class-13-right-diligence/  Old Path, White Cloudshttps://plumvillage.org/books/old-path-white-clouds-2/  Aṅgulimālahttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A%E1%B9%85gulim%C4%81la  The Five Mindfulness Trainingshttps://plumvillage.org/mindfulness/the-5-mindfulness-trainings/  Deer Park Monasteryhttps://deerparkmonastery.org/ Quotes “Being mindful, having love for oneself, is also learning to be true to oneself. And sometimes that means learning to say no to certain situations because we’re not yet capable. The practice here is not to feel despair or to lose faith in oneself because one cannot yet embrace such a situation; that can become an ingredient for aspiration and determination, so that we can cultivate our capacity to be there, to embrace, and to transform.”  “Am I watering the seeds of mindfulness, the seeds of concentration, the seeds of understanding, the seeds of kindness? Or am I being watered by the seeds of violence, anger, fear, despair, jealousy? As a practitioner, mindfulness becomes a light to identify what is coming into our senses via our eyes, our ears, our nose, our tongue, our mind, and our body. And we have to learn to be mindful of what is coming in, because that will be the energy for us to give out.”  “A good teacher, a good leader, a good parent, a good mentor is someone who is attentive to the kind of training that the one that they’re training needs. Our teacher, Thay was very mindful in understanding his students. In a way, Thay was studying us and he had to have the sensitivity – his mindfulness and his openness – to see each student differently and recognize what kind of ‘medicine’ they needed.”  “In hostile moments, if it’s not safe, you are allowed to protect yourself. Don’t think that being compassionate is to withstand everything; we also have to love ourselves. We have to know our capacity, we have to protect ourselves for everyone else. Thay would sometimes tell us, ‘You are more than just you: you also have to protect your teacher, which is me, you have to protect your parents, who are your ancestors, and your colleagues. So don’t allow yourself to burn out, because when you do, we all burn out with you.’ And at first I thought he was just referring to work, but there is also burning out in our spirit. We have to continue to nourish our heart and compassion. We have to know our limits.”  “Please, do not wait until you are angry, until you are violent, to practice. At that moment, it is too late. We have to already have invested our capacity to embrace and call our emotion by its name in the present moment.”  “If you want revenge, dig two graves.” “With distance, there’s understanding. With time, the heat of the moment dissipates.”  “A good teacher is someone who takes time to have a relationship. I truly believe that before trying to help someone, I have to also have time to be human with that person: having a cup of tea, seeing them as a friend, not just as a student or as younger, or a mentee.”  “In Buddhism we always say don’t be too intense with everything but also not too loose, knowing what is enough.” “Sometimes true love is just learning to let go.” “Thay talks about how, if you say something negative to someone or you’ve acted in anger, you can send a kind thought afterwards to neutralize it.” 
    09/02/2023
    1:22:30

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About The Way Out Is In

This podcast series is aimed at helping us to transcend our fear and anger so that we can be more engaged in the world in a way that develops love and compassion. Thich Nhat Hanh’s calligraphy ‘The Way Out Is In” highlights that the way out of any difficulty is to look deeply within, gain insights and then put them into practice. "The Way Out is In" is co-hosted by Brother Phap Huu, Thich Nhat Hanh's personal attendant for 17 years and the abbot of Plum Village's Upper Hamlet, and Jo Confino, who works at the intersection of personal transformation and systems change. The podcast is co-produced by the Plum Village App and Global Optimism, with support from the Thich Nhat Hanh Foundation.
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