Cleaning Up: Leadership in an Age of Climate Change

Despite the Trump administration's efforts to roll back clean energy subsidies and climate policies, America's energy transition is proving more resilient than many expected. Solar and battery deployment continues, nuclear power is attracting billions in private investment, and demand for electricity is surging. But after a historic set of midterms where does the US go from here?
In this episode of Cleaning Up, host Bryony Worthington speaks to David Victor, Professor of Innovation and Public Policy at the University of California, San Diego, about the political and economic forces shaping America's energy future.
They discuss what the US midterm elections mean for energy and climate policy, why renewable energy is continuing to grow in Republican states, and how the explosion in data centre demand is transforming the electricity industry. They also explore the backlash against AI infrastructure, the prospects for a new generation of nuclear reactors, the future of electric vehicles and America's increasingly complicated relationship with China.
Victor argues that the fundamentals of the energy transition are stronger than the political headlines suggest. But with an unreliable federal government, and public resistance to new infrastructure, the challenge now is turning technological progress into something that works for everyone.
Topics discussed in this episode:
The US Midterm Elections and the Energy Agenda
The Future of Clean Energy Under Trump
Data Centres, Electricity Demand and the Grid
The Politics of Building New Infrastructure
The Damage to American Government Institutions
Nuclear Power and the Role of Private Investment
Why Climate Change Is Struggling to Gain Political Attention
The Future of Electric Vehicles
Electric Aviation and New Technologies
China, Trade Restrictions and the EV Industry
Critical Minerals and Battery Recycling
Leadership Circle:
Cleaning Up is proud to be supported by its Leadership Circle. The members are Actis, Alcazar Energy, Arup, Climate Imperative Foundation, Copenhagen Infrastructure Partners, Cygnum Capital, Davidson Kempner, EcoPragma Capital, EDP, Eurelectric, KKR, Mitsubishi Heavy Industries, National Grid, Octopus Energy, Quadrature Climate Foundation, Schneider Electric, SDCL and Wärtsilä.
Links:
David Victor's article for the World Economic Forum: Why Lithium Is Not Oil: https://www.weforum.org/stories/energy-transition/lithium-is-not-oil-heres-why-that-matters
Heart Aerospace and its work on hybrid-electric aircraft: https://youtu.be/hW3uTBbAGHA
The Bipartisan American Affordability and Jobs Act of 2026: https://www.congress.gov/crs-product/IN12746
Chapters:
00:00 America's Energy Future
00:59 The Midterms and Energy
04:26 America's Electoral Puzzle
07:53 Did Energy Matter?
11:54 The Democrats' Next Move
14:21 Can Trump Stop Clean Energy?
19:36 The Data Centre Backlash
24:50 Powering the AI Boom
29:31 The Permitting Problem
32:21 Is Government Ready?
35:15 Nuclear's Private Investors
41:22 Nuclear's Bipartisan Appeal
44:30 The Future of EVs
48:12 The Next Aviation Breakthrough
51:13 Keeping Out Chinese EVs
53:33 The Critical Minerals Question
56:10 The Case for Battery Recycling

Mexico’s energy future is closely tied to its neighbour to the north. It imports much of its natural gas from the US, but could it soon be exporting clean electricity, or even data, in return? With electricity demand surging, Mexico is preparing for a major expansion of its power system, with 30GW of new generation planned by 2030 and more than $40bn in potential investment.
This week on Cleaning Up, Bryony Worthington speaks to Alberto Estefan, Managing Director of Energy Infrastructure at Actis, about the scale of Mexico’s renewables opportunity. They discuss the country’s growing electricity needs, its dependence on US natural gas, and the investment needed to transform its power system. They also explore the challenges of grid expansion, the role of batteries and whether Mexico could become an energy and data exporter to the US.
Topics covered in this episode:
Mexico’s renewables boom
Latin America’s investment opportunity
The US-Mexico energy relationship
The economics of solar and batteries
Mexico’s new investment framework
Does natural gas still have a role?
Mexico as a potential data and energy exporter
The risks of delivering the energy transition
El Niño and Latin America’s energy security
Leadership Circle:
Cleaning Up is proud to be supported by its Leadership Circle. The members are Actis, Alcazar Energy, Arup, Climate Imperative Foundation, Copenhagen Infrastructure Partners, Cygnum Capital, Davidson Kempner, EcoPragma Capital, EDP, Eurelectric, KKR, Mitsubishi Heavy Industries, National Grid, Octopus Energy, Quadrature Climate Foundation, Schneider Electric, SDCL and Wärtsilä.
Links:
Alberto Estefan’s bio: https://www.linkedin.com/in/alberto-estefan-71812b63/
Actis: https://www.act.is/
Actis' Lucy Heintz on Cleaning Up: https://youtu.be/nhGDI_0QIHg
Robert Capuano on Cleaning Up: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DxbUkAY_jCs
Subscribe to the Cleaning Up Newsletter: https://cleaninguppod.substack.com/
Acronyms:
CFE: Comisión Federal de Electricidad (Federal Electricity Commission)
PPA: Power Purchase Agreement
CAISO: California Independent System Operator
EPC: Engineering, Procurement, and Construction
Chapters:
00:00 Intro
02:22 Latin America
05:10 Mexico’s Growth
18:42 Solar Expansion
21:14 Investment Framework
27:58 Building Businesses
34:19 Gas and Renewables
37:25 Grid and Batteries
44:35 Data Exports
48:22 Delivery Risks
54:50 El Niño
58:18 Outro

The grid is one of the most important assets in any functioning energy system, transmitting electricity from where it's generated to where it's needed. In Ukraine, that challenge is enormous.
The country is very big, 1,300 kilometers from east to west, almost the distance from London to Rome. And the system is under constant attack from Russia, which targets the grid with everything from tiny drones to ballistic missiles.
In this fourth episode of our Ukraine Deep Dive, we're featuring two separate conversations with guests intimately familiar with the operations of that grid: Vitalii Zaichenko, the current chair and CEO of Ukrenergo, Ukraine's national grid operator, and Volodymyr Kudrytskyi, the former CEO of Ukrenergo from 2020 to 2024, and now co-founder of Negen.
Michael asks each of them how you protect a grid under constant attack. They also talk about the remarkable story of how Ukraine disconnected itself from the Russian grid and connected itself to the European grid in just three weeks at the beginning of the full-scale invasion, how to build more resilient energy systems, and why there's so much political scandal around the management of Ukrenergo and whether Ukraine could be better prepared for winter.
Topics covered in this episode:
Russia’s attacks on Ukraine’s electricity grid
Protecting substations from missiles and drones
Ukraine’s rapid synchronisation with Europe
The shift towards decentralised power generation
Batteries balancing nuclear, solar and wind
Financing and insuring energy projects in Ukraine
The political controversy surrounding Ukrenergo’s leadership
Lessons for global energy system resilience
Leadership Circle:
Cleaning Up is proud to be supported by its Leadership Circle. The members are Actis, Alcazar Energy, Arup, Climate Imperative Foundation, Copenhagen Infrastructure Partners, Cygnum Capital, Davidson Kempner, EcoPragma Capital, EDP, Eurelectric, KKR, Mitsubishi Heavy Industries, National Grid, Octopus Energy, Quadrature Climate Foundation, Schneider Electric, SDCL and Wärtsilä.
Links:
Vitalii Zaichenko’s bio: https://ua.energy/about_us/the-management/chairman-of-the-management-board/
Volodymyr Kudrytskyi’s bio: https://www.linkedin.com/in/volodymyr-kudrytskyi-45233161/
Ukrenergo: https://ua.energy/en/
Negen: https://www.negen.energy/en
News articles covering Volodymyr’s arrest and bail: https://kyivindependent.com/ukraine-ex-grid-operator-chief-detained-over-suspected-embezzlement-of-state-company-funds/
https://www.osw.waw.pl/en/publikacje/analyses/2025-11-03/kudrytskyis-arrest-attempt-to-intimidate-representatives-state
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c4g5380xwqjo

Wärtsilä’s Håkan Agnevall on Cleaning Up: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dUYjGT55g5A&t=2s
Subscribe to the Cleaning Up Newsletter: https://cleaninguppod.substack.com/
Acronyms:
TSO: Transmission System Operator
ENTSO-E: European Network of Transmission System Operators for Electricity
DFI: Development Finance Institution
IFI: International Financial Institution
EBRD: European Bank for Reconstruction and Development
Chapters:
00:00 Intro
02:34 Ukraine’s Grid
08:56 The Need for Flexibility
11:18 Protecting the Grid
14:10 Repairing the Damage
19:58 Connecting to Europe
29:04 Ukrenergo Leadership Controversy
31:11 Decentralised Power
41:20 Kudrytskyi’s Dismissal
45:35 Preparing for Winter
47:03 Attracting Investment
50:54 The Role of Gas
53:34 Lessons for the World
56:05 Outro

Indonesia is facing a defining question: can it continue to grow its economy while making the shift towards a greener future? In this episode of Cleaning Up, guest host Marie Cheong speaks with Sandiaga Uno, chair of Mutuagung Lestari International and former Deputy Governor of Jakarta and Minister of Tourism, about Indonesia’s potential to become a major player in the green economy, and why the country’s natural resources, growing energy needs and entrepreneurial ecosystem could create significant opportunities for climate solutions and investment.
They explore whether green investing could be the next major growth opportunity, why the economics need to stack up, and how moving beyond the idea of a “green premium” towards “green discounts” could make sustainable business models more competitive. From the challenge of moving away from coal while meeting rising energy demand, to the potential of carbon credits and nature-based solutions, the conversation looks at what it will take to turn Indonesia’s green potential into real economic and environmental value and what investors should consider before taking the plunge.
Topics covered in this episode:
Indonesia’s green growth potential
Green investing’s next growth cycle
Green premiums vs. green discounts
Politics and the energy transition
Moving beyond coal
Carbon credits and nature-based solutions
Turning green potential into profits
What green investors should look for
Leadership Circle:
Cleaning Up is proud to be supported by its Leadership Circle. The members are Actis, Alcazar Energy, Arup, Climate Imperative Foundation, Copenhagen Infrastructure Partners, Cygnum Capital, Davidson Kempner, EcoPragma Capital, EDP, Eurelectric, KKR, Mitsubishi Heavy Industries, National Grid, Octopus Energy, Quadrature Climate Foundation, Schneider Electric, SDCL and Wärtsilä. For more information on the Leadership Circle, please visit cleaningup.live.
Links
Sandiaga Uno’s bio: https://www.linkedin.com/in/sandiaga-salahuddin-uno-7803b642a/
Saratoga: https://saratoga-investama.com/
Sandiaga’s article for the Center for International Relations and Sustainable Development: https://cirsd.org/horizon-article/from-rebuilding-to-refining-2/
Mutuagung Lestari Tbk (MUTU): https://mutucertification.com/en/
Subscribe to the Cleaning Up Newsletter: https://cleaninguppod.substack.com
Acronyms:
MUTU: Mutuagung Lestari International
JETP: Just Energy Transition Partnership
SBY: Susilo Bambang Yudhoyono, previous President of Indonesia
Chapters
00:00 Intro
00:51 About Indonesia
13:03 Saratoga’s Evolution
20:47 Green Discounts
26:18 Energy Transition
32:08 Rising Energy Demand
37:14 Growth and Policy
43:23 Carbon Credits
52:33 Nature-Based Solutions
55:21 Climate Investing
01:02:31 Outro

One of the biggest questions when it comes to the brutal and drawn-out Russia-Ukraine war is how it can be brought to an end, and crucially, could it ever be replaced by a stable peace? To understand this, we have to ask not just where we are now, but how we got here.
For episode 03 of our Deep Dive Ukraine, Michael Liebreich is in Kyiv with John E. Herbst, Senior Director of the Atlantic Council’s Eurasia Centre and former US Ambassador to Ukraine, to explore the origins of the Russia-Ukraine conflict, the chance for a stable peace, Russia and Ukraine’s vulnerabilities, and the role of NATO. They also examine the changing US approach to military support and negotiations, and the risks of a peace deal that forces Ukraine to surrender territory.
Topics covered in this episode:
Why Putin invaded Ukraine
Ukraine’s strikes on Russian oil infrastructure
NATO expansion and Russian aggression
The legacy of the Orange Revolution
The cracks in Putin’s regime
Trump’s shifting approach to peace
The risks of territorial concessions
Can Russia’s regime collapse?
Links:
John E. Herbst’s bio: https://www.atlanticcouncil.org/expert/john-e-herbst/
Atlantic Council Eurasia Center: https://www.atlanticcouncil.org/programs/eurasia-center
Michael’s Substack on Ukraine striking Russian oil refineries: https://mliebreich.substack.com/p/why-ukraine-should-keep-striking
Subscribe to our newsletter: https://cleaninguppod.substack.com
MAP - Membership Action Plan
FSB - Federal Security Service (Russia)
Leadership Circle:
Cleaning Up is proud to be supported by its Leadership Circle. The members are Actis, Alcazar Energy, Arup, Climate Imperative Foundation, Copenhagen Infrastructure Partners, Cygnum Capital, Davidson Kempner, EcoPragma Capital, EDP, Eurelectric, KKR, Mitsubishi Heavy Industries, National Grid, Octopus Energy, Quadrature Climate Foundation, Schneider Electric, SDCL and Wärtsilä. For more information on the Leadership Circle, please visit cleaningup.live.
Chapters:
00:00 Intro
02:15 The Orange Revolution
06:45 Putin’s Ambitions
11:00 NATO and Ukraine
16:30 US Policy Shifts
22:00 Ukraine’s Oil Strikes
26:00 Sanctions Hit Russia
29:00 Cracks in Putin’s Regime
36:00 Ukraine’s Winter
39:00 Paths to Peace
44:27 Outro