Brand Growth Heroes

Most challenger founders assume international expansion should happen in neat, logical steps. New Zealand → Australia → UK → US. But Lisa's view was different, and that's why it's so interesting:
In fact, conventional FMCG wisdom tells us to prove your business in nearby markets first. But founder Lisa King of Free AF Drinks ignored that advice!  After building a 40% share brand in New Zealand, Lisa decided to skip Australia entirely and went straight after the most competitive drinks market in the world...the USA!
Why? 

--> If the ambition was always to build a globally valuable business, she asked herself why spend years proving the model somewhere that wasn't ultimately where the biggest opportunity sat?
In this brilliant conversation with Kiwi female founder Lisa, you'll hear how today AF Drinks is stocked in more than 4,500 stores across the US, including Target, Walmart, Whole Foods and Kroger, and just HOW they're doing it. 
We discuss why she made they made the decision they did, how Pernod Ricard Ventures invested before the US launch, what it really takes to build a beverage brand in America, why alcohol-free RTD cocktails are outperforming expectations, and the lessons founders should understand before attempting to scale internationally.
Lisa takes us through a masterclass in the realities of the beverage market in the United States; Why alcohol-free RTD cocktails are growing faster than many expected and finally, how she has approached fundraising, equity and scaling internationally!
Key Topics Discussed
 Alcohol-free drinks category growth 
 Building challenger brands internationally 
 International expansion & export to USA  
 Listings with Target, Walmart, Whole Foods and Kroger 
 US grocery retail
 Walmart and Target listings 
 Fundraising and investor strategy 
 Pernod Ricard Ventures investment 
 Beverage category economics 
 Product innovation, IP & technology 
 Ready-to-drink cocktails 
 Scaling consumer brands globally 
 Founder leadership 
 Building brands from New Zealand 
USEFUL LINKS
AF Drinks Website
AF Drinks Instagram
Like this episode?
PLEASE share the love by sharing this episode with another founder building a challenger brand, a colleague or a mate who loves brilliant non-alcoholic drinks, or anyone trying to work out how to build a consumer packaged goods business.
Don't forget to FOLLOW or SUBSCRIBE to Brand Growth Heroes on your favourite podcast app, and even LEAVE A REVIEW - both of these actions make a MASSIVE difference to our mission to help more founders just like you.
Follow us
Instagram (https://www.instagram.com/brandgrowthheroes)
LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/company/brand-growth-heroes/?viewAsMember=true)
Youtube (https://www.youtube.com/@brandgrowthheroes)
Find out more about the programmes and courses Fiona runs here (https://www.brandgrowthheroes.com/mini-mba-2026)
Join the NextGen CPG WhatsApp group for founders leaning in to the value that a leadership approach to engaging with AI can unlock for businesses like yours.
*** Thanks to Brand Growth Heroes’ podcast sponsor - Joelson, the commercial law firm ***

If you're a founder, you already know how much energy goes into building the perfect product, creating standout branding and connecting with consumers.
But scaling a CPG business also brings legal complexities that can make or break your growth journey - from contracts and regulatory compliance to protecting your intellectual property.
That’s why I'm proud to partner with Joelson, the leading commercial law firm specialising in helping founders of scaling consumer brands.
Joelson works with brands like Little Moons, Trip, Eat Natural, Bear Graze and Pulsin, and advised the innocent founders on their landmark sale to Coca-Cola - and still work with them at JamJar Investments today!
Joelson is offering a FREE LEGAL CONSULTATION to all BGH listeners (mailto:hello@joelsonlaw.com) - I honestly recommend you take them up on it, they're brilliant.
CREDITS
Thanks to our Sound Engineer Gyp Buggane at Ballagroove.com

In this episode of Brand Growth Heroes, I’m joined by founder Bethan Higson and Alice Gallsworthy of Mother Root. Get this: Mother Root is already the UK’s number one non-alcoholic spirit brand in terms of revenue driven per product. Whoah.
So what's the deal? This ginger-based non-alcoholic aperitif is different to most playing in food and beverage, as it only has one core SKU, but an incredibly powerful DTC growth engine. Even though it's the UK's No1 non-alc spirit, it still only has around 6–7% distribution -  talk about headroom for growth!
As you might imagine, Bethan and Alice are incredibly clear on the choices that created their growth. We talk about why they stopped trying to do everything, how they went all-in on DTC, how customer interviews and jobs-to-be-done thinking shaped their marketing, and why the product itself delivers something so many non-alcoholic drinks miss: flavour, ritual, heat, length and a real adult drinking moment. We also get into team building, finding the right second-in-command, launching into the US, and why operations has to scale at the same rate as marketing if you don’t want the business to break.
What You’ll Learn
 How Mother Root grew from around £1.5M to £15–16M run rate. 
 Why focus on one channel helped build a repeatable and scalable growth model. 
 How jobs-to-be-done customer interviews shaped Mother Root’s digital marketing. 
 Why the non-alcoholic drinks consumer is not necessarily the Gen Z sober-curious stereotype. 
 How Bethan and Alice think about hiring, operations, US expansion and scaling without breaking the business. 
Why AI is part of EVERY part of the working day at Mother Root
Key Topics Discussed
 Mother Root’s growth from early-stage brand to £15–16M run rate 
 Building a challenger brand with one core SKU 
 The evening drink ritual and the role of non-alcoholic drinks 
 Ginger, apple cider vinegar, slow burn and flavour architecture 
 Choosing where to play and walking away from distracting channels 
 Building a DTC growth engine 
 Paid social, customer interviews and jobs-to-be-done insight 
 Word of mouth and repeat purchase 
 Nielsen performance and retail headroom 
 Hiring a brilliant number two 
 Scaling operations alongside marketing 
 Launching Mother Root in the US 
 Why the non-alcoholic category is not just about Gen Z 
Useful Links
https://motherroot.com/
https://www.instagram.com/motherroot/
Like this episode? 
PLEASE share the love by sharing this episode with another founder building a challenger brand, a colleague or a mate who loves brilliant non-alcoholic drinks, or anyone trying to work out how to build a sharper, more focused growth model. 
Don't forget to FOLLOW or SUBSCRIBE to Brand Growth Heroes on your favourite podcast app, and even LEAVE A REVIEW - both of these actions make a MASSIVE difference to our mission to help more founders just like you.
Join our community on Instagram, LinkedIn and Youtube, and find out more about the programmes and courses Fiona runs, as well as the NextGen CPG WhatsApp group for founders leaning in to the value that a leadership approach to engaging with AI can unlock for businesses like yours.
Follow Brand Growth Heroes on LinkedIn, Instagram, Facebook and YouTube.

*****Thanks to Brand Growth Heroes’ podcast sponsor  - Joelson, the commercial law firm *****

If you're a founder, you already know how much energy goes into building the perfect product, creating standout branding and connecting with consumers.
But scaling a CPG business also brings legal complexities that can make or break your growth journey - from contracts and regulatory compliance to protecting your intellectual property.
That’s why we’re proud to partner with Joelson, the leading commercial law firm specialising in helping founders of scaling consumer brands.
Joelson works with brands like Little Moons, Trip, Eat Natural, Bear Graze and Pulsin, and advised the innocent founders on their landmark sale to Coca-Cola - and still work with them at JamJar Investments today!
To learn more contact hello@joelsonlaw.com - in fact, Joelson is offering Brand Growth Heroes listeners a FREE Legal consultation - we highly recommend you take them up on this! 
Credits
Thanks to our Sound Engineer Gyp Buggane at Ballagroove.com and all the Brand Growth Heroes team.

In this episode, I’m joined by digital strategist Sara Wilson, who coined the term “digital campfires” in Harvard Business Review, to explore why community is becoming one of the most important growth channels for CPG challenger brands. Sara works with brands including Nike, Netflix, YouTube, Airstream, Yahoo, PopSockets and Prince Street Pizza, helping them understand how to show up inside the communities where influence, identity and belonging are really being shaped.
This conversation completely EVOLVED how I think about social media and its role in driving brand growth - genuinely.
We talk about why the most important conversations may no longer be happening publicly on Instagram or TikTok, but in DMs, WhatsApp groups, niche communities, gaming spaces, Substack, Reddit and beyond.
Sara shares why brands need to stop thinking only about reach and followers, and start thinking much more deeply about identity, transformation and the communities their consumers already belong to.
Watch the episode on Youtube here.
What You’ll Learn
 Why Sara believes the future of influence is happening inside “digital campfires”. 
 The three types of digital campfires: private messaging, micro-communities and shared experiences. 
 Why relevance matters more than reach if you want people to share your brand. 
 How brands like Poppi and McDonald’s have embedded themselves into communities. 
 Why founders need to understand the transformation their brand offers. 
Key Topics Discussed
 Community as a growth channel. 
 Why DMs and private spaces matter. 
 The “OMG, that’s so me” effect. 
 Identity, belonging and relevance. 
 Why brands should embed into existing communities. 
 Poppi’s winning 'sorority' strategy. 
 McDonald’s Grimace and Mets community moment. 
 How to create high-value community engagement. 
 Why sampling and discounts are not enough. 
 How founders can rethink brand strategy through a community-first lens. 
Useful Links
Connect with Sara Wilson on LinkedIn
https://www.linkedin.com/in/saraewilson/
Sara Wilson’s newsletter
https://communitycatalysts.substack.com/
Sara Wilson’s website
https://swprojects.co/
We love inspiring you and helping your business to grow! PLEASE share the love by sharing this episode with another founder building a challenger brand, a colleague or a mate who loves thinking about community, culture and the future of brand growth.

Don't forget to FOLLOW or SUBSCRIBE to Brand Growth Heroes on your favourite podcast app, and even LEAVE A REVIEW - both of these actions make a MASSIVE difference to our mission to help more founders just like you.
Join our community on Instagram, LinkedIn, and find out more about the programmes and courses Fiona runs, as well as the NextGen CPG WhatsApp group for founders leaning in to the value that a leadership approach to engaging with AI can unlock for businesses like yours.

**** Thanks to Brand Growth Heroes’ podcast sponsor - Joelson, the commercial law firm.****
If you're a founder, you already know how much energy goes into building the perfect product, creating standout branding and connecting with consumers.
But scaling a CPG business also brings legal complexities that can make or break your growth journey - from contracts and regulatory compliance to protecting your intellectual property.
That’s why we’re proud to partner with Joelson, the leading commercial law firm specialising in helping founders of scaling consumer brands.
Joelson works with brands like Little Moons, Trip, Eat Natural, Bear Graze and Pulsin, and advised the innocent founders on their landmark sale to Coca-Cola - and still work with them at JamJar Investments today!
***The fabulous team at Joelson is offering a free legal consultation to any CPG founder listening -  Book your session today!**
Credits
Thanks to our Sound Engineer Gyp Buggane at Ballagroove.com.

In this week’s episode, I’m joined by Sarah and Michael Vachon, the founders of Citizens of Soil, one of the most exciting challenger brands in food and drink right now. We explore how they are transforming olive oil from a commoditised pantry staple into a brand built on transparency, craft, regenerative farming and fairer value for producers, while building a modern consumer brand with real emotional connection and standout commercial momentum.
What I loved about this conversation is that it is about so much more than premium olive oil. Sarah and Michael share how they spotted a broken supply chain, why they chose to back small producers and female-led groves, and how a simple shift from calling something a subscription to calling it a club changed the business's growth trajectory. If you are building a consumer brand and thinking about community, premiumisation, founder focus and how to create real value in a category, there is so much to learn here.
What You’ll Learn
- Why Citizens of Soil saw a much bigger opportunity than simply selling premium olive oil
- How changing “subscription” to “club” drove a dramatic increase in member growth
- What founders can learn from borrowing packaging and positioning cues from adjacent categories
- Why direct customer insight and social listening led to the launch of the Health Club
- How Sarah and Michael are balancing rapid growth, team building and direct producer relationships

Key Topics Discussed
- Rebuilding value in a commoditised olive oil category
- Regenerative farming and fairer producer economics
- Borrowing premium cues from the wine category
- DTC growth and the Olive Oil Club model
- Community building versus transactional selling
- Nutrition-led innovation and high polyphenol oils
- Retail growth across Waitrose, Ocado, Booths, Fortnum & Mason and Selfridges
- Building a team to support DTC and brand-led growth
- Working as a husband-and-wife founder team
- Premium pricing, value creation and consumer behaviour

Useful Links
Website https://www.citizensofsoil.com/
Connect with Michael https://www.linkedin.com/in/vachonline/
Connect with Sarah https://www.linkedin.com/in/sarahfulton/
Connect with Citizens of Soil on LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/company/citizens-of-soil/posts/?feedView=all
We love inspiring you and helping your business to grow! PLEASE share the love by sharing this episode with another founder building a challenger brand, a colleague or a mate who loves brilliant food brands and category reinvention. Don't forget to FOLLOW or SUBSCRIBE to Brand Growth Heroes on your favourite podcast app, and even LEAVE A REVIEW - both of these actions make a MASSIVE difference to our mission to help more founders just like you.
Join our community on Instagram, LinkedIn and YouTube, and find out more about the programmes and courses Fiona runs, as well as the NextGen CPG WhatsApp group for founders leaning in to the value that a leadership approach to engaging with AI can unlock for businesses like yours.
Follow Brand Growth Heroes on LinkedIn, Instagram, Facebook and YouTube.
*****Thanks to Brand Growth Heroes’ podcast sponsor Joelson, a B Corp-certified commercial law firm****************
If you're a founder, you already know how much energy goes into building the perfect product, creating standout branding and connecting with consumers.
Scaling a CPG business also brings legal complexities that can make or break your growth journey - from contracts and regulatory compliance to protecting your intellectual property.
That’s why we’re proud to partner with Joelson, the leading commercial law firm specialising in helping founders of scaling consumer brands.
Joelson works with brands like Little Moons, TRIP, Two Chicks, graze and Crosta & Mollica, and advised the Innocent founders on their landmark sale to Coca-Cola - and still work with them today!
Joelson are SO brilliant that they are offering a free consultation to any CPG brand founder -  book your consultation with one of the Joelson lawyers here: https://joelsonlaw.com/contact/bookings/
*****************

Thanks to our Sound Engineer Gyp Buggane at Ballagroove.com and podcast producer/content creator Kathryn Watts, Social KEWS https://socialkews.co.uk/

Today, I’m joined by Emma Woods, Chair of Ancient+Brave, ex CEO of wagamama, and one of the most experienced growth leaders I know.
Emma has done the full journey - Unilever, high-growth markets in Mexico, PizzaExpress, Merlin, Wagamama and now she brings all of that to the challenger brands who need it most, as a chair and board director.
This isn't a conversation about corporate playbooks. It's about what actually works when you're building something from the ground up.
We go deep on boards -  why so many founders get this wrong, and what to do instead. Emma introduces the concept of a Growth Chair: not just governance, but someone who's been at your stage of growth and can help you make better decisions, faster.
We also get into confidence, imposter syndrome, leadership stretch,  and why, despite real progress, women are still underrepresented in the rooms where it matters.
Emma shares her Vital 5 -  a framework for the metrics and decisions that actually move a brand forward.
If you're building a challenger brand, this one will change how you think.
What You'll Learn
- Why most founders get their board wrong and what a Growth Chair actually does
- How to find and brief the right advisors for your stage of growth
- Emma's Vital 5: the metrics and mindset shifts that drive real growth
- How to lead when you're constantly outside your comfort zone
- Why confidence isn't a personality trait… it's a practice
- The real state of women in senior business leadership and what needs to change

Key Topics Discussed
- Emma Woods’ journey from Unilever to Wagamama CEO to board leadership
- What high-growth markets teach you about speed, instinct and leadership
- When founders should introduce a board and why timing matters
- Governance vs growth: what boards should actually be doing
- The “Vital Five”  and how to focus your business
- Why consumer brands are “leaky buckets” (and what to do about it)
- The PizzaExpress promotion lesson and the long-term cost of short-term growth
- What makes a great chair-founder relationship
- Growth leadership vs traditional leadership
- Women in business: boards, CEOs and the “power seat” gap
- Confidence, imposter syndrome and leadership stretch
- Emma’s Conversations in Confidence series
Useful links:
Connect with Emma Woods on LinkedIn
Emma’s Conversations in Confidence series

We love inspiring you and helping your business to grow. Please share this episode with another founder building a challenger brand, a colleague, or a mate who is interested in the future of food, content-led growth and scaling consumer brands. Don’t forget to follow or subscribe to Brand Growth Heroes on your favourite podcast app, and please leave a review too. Both of those actions make a massive difference to our mission to help more founders just like you.
You can also connect with Brand Growth Heroes on LinkedIn, Instagram, Facebook and YouTube, find out more about the programmes and courses I run, and join our NextGen CPG WhatsApp group for founders leaning into the value that a leadership approach to engaging with AI can unlock for businesses like yours.

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Thanks to Brand Growth Heroes’ podcast sponsor - Joelson, a B Corp certified commercial law firm.
If you're a founder, you already know how much energy goes into building the perfect product, creating standout branding and connecting with consumers.
But scaling a CPG business also brings legal complexities that can make or break your growth journey - from contracts and regulatory compliance to protecting your intellectual property.
That’s why we’re proud to partner with Joelson, the leading commercial law firm specialising in helping founders of scaling consumer brands.
Joelson works with brands like Little Moons, TRIP, Two Chicks, graze and Crosta & Mollica, and advised the Innocent founders on their landmark sale to Coca-Cola - and still work with them today!
Do you need legal advice as you grow your brand? Take this BIG opportunity and book a free consultation with one of Joelson lawyers here. 
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Thanks to our Sound Engineer, Gyp Buggane, Ballagroove.com and podcast producer, Kathryn Watts, Social KEWS.