Big Boss Interview

The chief executive of the world's largest water company has said Veolia would consider running Britain's water infrastructure if it were taken into public ownership, opening the door to a model in which the state owns the assets but private companies operate them.
Asked whether that could mean "nationalise the assets, and Veolia comes in to manage them," Estelle Brachlianoff said: "It could be an option, yes."
She described what that could look like in practice: Veolia running drinking water facilities, wastewater treatment plants and network management under contract, as it already does in other countries. What she ruled out was buying Thames Water. Pressed on the commercial opportunity, she said the ownership model was for government to decide.
Brachlianoff leads a business with around €45 billion in turnover and 220,000 employees worldwide, including 15,000 in the UK. She says drought and water scarcity cost the British economy more than £1 billion this summer, with two-thirds of the country affected by drought and some areas coming close to rationing.
Her warning is that this is not an exceptional summer but the beginning of a pattern. Climate change means shortages will become more frequent and more severe, she argues, and waiting until the next crisis will ultimately cost households and government more.
That leads to the question she is repeatedly pressed on: who pays?
Britain needs to fix leaks, increase resilience, deal with contaminants including PFAS "forever chemicals" and prepare for rapidly growing demand, while households remain under pressure and the Treasury faces competing calls on public money. Brachlianoff accepts that investment is needed, but argues that the answer is not simply to spend more. It is to spend more intelligently.
Instead of digging up and replacing entire stretches of leaking pipe, for example, she advocates using AI to pinpoint the precise sections that are failing. She also points to greater reuse of wastewater, noting that treated wastewater already provides around 75% of irrigation water in Jordan, alongside the possible expansion of desalination.
Her claim is that technology and efficiency could allow Britain to make its water system more resilient without water bills increasing as a proportion of household income. But she acknowledges that guarantee becomes much harder if the country waits until the next shortage before acting.
For Brachlianoff, water is increasingly a national security issue as much as an environmental one. She points to the Middle East, where desalination plants have appeared on military target lists and some Veolia facilities are now protected by Patriot missile systems. Britain's risks are less dramatic, but the underlying principle is the same: without secure water supplies there is no food production, no industry and no functioning economy.
And demand is about to become more complicated.
According to Veolia, by 2030, UK data centres are forecast to consume the equivalent of the combined water use of Birmingham and Glasgow. Brachlianoff says tensions between communities and data centres over access to water are already becoming political issues in parts of the United States.
Elsewhere, the environmental case becomes more contested. Veolia says it can now destroy PFAS - or "forever chemicals" contaminants to 99.9999%, but the question of who should pay for cleaning up decades of pollution remains unresolved. Brachlianoff says the cost will probably have to be shared between government, industry and consumers.
Presenter: Justin Rowlatt
Producer: Olie D'Albertanson

Big Boss Interview brings together some of the world's most influential business leaders to discuss the opportunities, pressures and decisions that shape the organisations they lead.
This special edition features highlights from interviews available in full on BBC Sounds. Presenter Felicity Hannah revisits conversations with executives from sectors including utilities, banking, retail, technology, consumer goods and entertainment, exploring everything from artificial intelligence and digital transformation to regulation, sustainability and leadership in challenging times.
Featuring Chris Weston of Thames Water, Charlie Nunn from Lloyds Banking Group, Andrea Vidler, who leads National Lottery operator Allwyn UK, Jackie Jantos of dating app Hinge, Dirk Van de Put from Mondelez International, owner of brands including Cadbury and Oreo, and Dan Finley, the boss of Debenhams Group.

Who should control Britain's biggest water company? Chris Weston, the chief executive of Thames Water, says he "completely agrees" with the Prime Minister that the industry, and Thames Water, needs greater public control. But he draws a clear distinction between stronger public accountability and public ownership, arguing that nationalisation or special administration could delay investment, increase uncertainty and ultimately leave taxpayers carrying the financial risk.
Thames spent more than £1bn more than it received last year, with the shortfall currently funded by creditors. Under special administration, Weston says that funding would instead have to come from government while a new owner was sought. Full nationalisation, he argues, would place Thames Water's decade-long infrastructure programme on the public balance sheet alongside defence, health and education. His preferred solution is the proposal from more than 100 creditors to write off around £9bn of debt, inject fresh equity and rebuild the company under a model that promises no dividends for at least ten years. He argues this private-sector restructuring can sit alongside stronger public oversight, clearer government direction, greater regional representation and a more company-specific regulatory regime.
The debate over ownership comes as Weston warns Britain faces a much bigger challenge. Drought, he says, is no longer an exceptional event but "the new normal". Despite an unusually wet January and February, no rain fell across the Thames Valley in July, exposing a shortage of water storage across the South East.
Thames has not built a reservoir since Farmoor B in 1977. A replacement scheme proposed around 2010 was rejected after the company failed to make its case successfully, and Weston believes the region would not be facing a hosepipe ban today had it been approved. The proposed Whitehorse reservoir near Abingdon remains in the planning process and is not expected to begin filling until 2038, with another three years needed before it reaches capacity.
Population growth, government housebuilding targets and the rapid expansion of data centres will place even greater pressure on supplies. Weston questions whether data centres should rely on drinking water for cooling, suggesting treated effluent from sewage works could provide an alternative. He also says households will need to become more mindful of how they use water, with government playing a greater role in encouraging behavioural change.
Weston also makes a notable concession about how the industry reached this point. Customers, he says, have "paid too little for water for too long". Thames operates 440 treatment works and a network stretching four times around the circumference of the Earth. Keeping bills low, he argues, meant insufficient investment in maintaining and modernising ageing infrastructure, although he accepts the company's current debt levels are unsustainable.
On pollution, Weston accepts Thames must improve but refuses to promise sewage incidents can ever be eliminated entirely. The company treats around 4.3 billion litres of wastewater every day and, he says, succeeds 99.5% of the time on average. Extreme weather, ageing infrastructure and illegal connections mean completely eliminating pollution incidents remains "very, very slim".
Presenter: Simon Jack
Producer: Olie D'Albertanson/Ollie Smith
00:00 BBC Editor, Simon Jack introduces podcast
03:09 Chris Weston joins pod, explains Thames Water's situation
06:18 Bills were too low for too long.
09:32 Unrealistic targets, swage and pollution
12:31 Privatisation of Thames Water
14:50 What's on the table now?
17:28 Greater public control, special administration and nationalisation
28:41 Drought, reservoirs and the new normal
34:29 Staff abuse and his own pay

etoro customers are "definitely moving away from crypto," according to the company's founder and chief executive, Yoni Assia. After more than a decade at the forefront of digital assets, Assia says customers are increasingly shifting towards mainstream investing and cash savings, as etoro expands beyond its trading platform into broader financial services. The company, which manages around $20 billion in customer assets for more than 40 million registered users, is pursuing a UK banking licence, launching a Visa debit card and expanding into everyday banking services.
Assia also discusses how etoro balances that expansion with its continued offering of cryptocurrency trading. Alongside ISAs and long-term savings products, the platform continues to offer access to crypto assets. Asked whether it is appropriate to offer highly speculative crypto products alongside mainstream savings, Assia said he believes customers should have choice, while acknowledging that the crypto market is "a much less regulated" and "much riskier" ecosystem than traditional capital markets.
The conversation also covers the growth of meme coins. Assia says he bought Donald Trump's cryptocurrency after it was listed on etoro. Asked whether he had made or lost money on the investment, he said he had not checked. Assia also highlighted the scale of the market, noting that while there are around 40,000 publicly listed companies worldwide, roughly 40,000 new meme coins are created every day on the Solana blockchain. He contrasted the level of regulation and disclosure required of listed companies with that of meme coins.
Artificial intelligence is another topic discussed in the interview. Assia says etoro rebuilt its new app in six months using code written entirely by AI and believes the company's AI assistant is already capable of providing financial guidance that rivals many human advisers. He also discusses how AI could change the way people manage their money and how established financial institutions may need to adapt.
The interview concludes with Assia's view of longer-term changes in financial services, including what he describes as a $140 trillion intergenerational transfer of wealth from baby boomers to younger generations. He explains why he believes younger investors will increasingly use AI-powered financial platforms, while also moving towards more traditional savings and investment products as they accumulate wealth.
Presenter: Sean Farrington
Producer: Olie D'Albertanson
Editor: Henry Jones
00:00 Introduction
02:00 The shift from crypto to banking
06:40 The rebrand and building an entire app with AI
09:00 Customers moving away from crypto and the boom-bust cycle
13:30 Bitcoin, quantum computing and the AI threat
17:28 Trump's meme coin and the losses suffered by investors
21:52 The copy trading transparency problem
24:30 The cost of living and whether ordinary people can afford risk
27:30 AI versus the traditional financial adviser
31:40 The $140 trillion generational wealth transfer

Andria Vidler, the CEO of Allwyn UK - the operator of the National Lottery - has warned the British public risks losing it, unless it innovates.
Allwyn took over the running of the National Lottery from Camelot in 2024, and it had pledged to double the amount if gives to good causes from 33 million pounds to 60 million pounds. But Vidler told Felicity Hannah that its future is at stake, if it doesn't continue to change and adapt at speed.
Part of this is the UK launch of Powerball, the first time the American lottery has been offered outside the United States. Unlike EuroMillions, its jackpots are uncapped and can rise into the hundreds of millions.
The interview also examines whether the National Lottery should be treated differently from other forms of gambling. Vidler rejected suggestions that draw-based games contribute significantly to gambling harm, arguing that waiting for a result removes the cycle of instant gratification associated with more addictive products. She also defended the lottery’s £500 weekly online deposit limit, saying most players spend nowhere near that amount and fewer than 2 per cent show any indication of problematic play. Allwyn has introduced over 100 new games in the last year.
Vidler has also called on the government to close a regulatory loophole which she says allows online prize draws to compete without paying lottery duty or contributing to good causes. Vidler claims that house raffles, car competitions and other online prize draws are “cloaking themselves in lottery disguise” and exploiting legislation intended for small society lotteries. “They will steal our lunch if we’re not careful,” she warned, arguing that Britain should return to a model centred on one National Lottery in order to maximise returns to good causes.
Presenter: Felicity Hannah
Producer: Olie D'Albertanson
Editor: Henry Jones
00:00 Sean and Fliss introduce the pod
03:17 Andria joins BBI, discusses 2024 takeover
06:07 The Gambling Commission investigation
10:01 Good causes target and cost of living
14:42 Problem gambling and player protection
17:23 The shift to digital
21:17 Powerball launch
22:38 Prize draw competition and the loophole
26:02 Future of National Lottery is uncertain if it doesn't innovate
32:45 Career, AI, cyber security and women in leadership