Most conflicts never actually get resolved, they just go quiet until they resurface somewhere else. Philosopher Paul Baker returns for his fourth conversation with host Maria Arpa to unpack his developing theory of systemic win, built around a simple but powerful order: address what's worse before chasing what's better.
Drawing on examples from couples therapy, prison work and restorative justice practice, Paul and Maria explore why a neutral third party who cares about the whole system can transform unresolved harm into a genuine foundation for repair, and why avoiding discomfort, including the human need to grieve, only delays the real work.
Listeners working in justice, mediation or restorative practice will take away a clearer framework for distinguishing surface-level fixes from root-cause healing, along with practical thinking on how to support both the harmed and the person who caused harm.
Tune in for a rich, reflective conversation on what it really takes to complete a conflict rather than just survive it.
KEY TAKEAWAYS
Address the "worse" before chasing the "better." Paul argues this order matters: skipping straight to positivity without dealing with what's actually wrong just papers over the problem.
Recognise that conflict you think is "resolved" often isn't. If it only de-escalated rather than being fully addressed, the unresolved part resurfaces and tangles itself into future disagreements.
Bring in a third party who cares about the whole system, not just one side. Mediators, facilitators or restorative justice practitioners who hold the wellbeing of everyone involved can shift a conflict into genuinely new territory.
Don't deny people the need to grieve a conflict or fallout. Treating every situation with forced positivity is a form of conflict avoidance that cuts people off from an important emotional process.
Remember that people who cause harm need healing too, separate from the people they harmed. Restorative justice practice should include support for the person who caused damage, delivered by someone not directly involved in the harm.
QUOTES
"We should pay attention, give significant attention, at least to the worse, to make sure that we aren't just... putting a plaster over the top."
"If you're not good in the fight, don't make the fight worse."
"As long as the conflict has de-escalated a bit, people think, oh, well, that conflict's dealt with. But it's not dealt with."
"To avoid or deny the human need for grieving is to cut part of our life off."
"When someone or some part of the system has lost, we mustn't punish the rest of the system around them just because they're associated with them."
Social Links
www.centreforpeacefulsolutions.org
www.peacefulsolutions.org.uk
www.workplacehuddle.com
HOST BIO
Maria founded the Centre for Peaceful Solutions in response to the fatal shooting of a 7 year old in her neighbourhood. She developed a model of conflict resolution for violent crime using her brainchild, the Dialogue Road Map (DRM).
Over 30 years she has mediated everything from threat to life gang disputes to high stakes business deals gone wrong, Maria empowers people to resolve conflict without reliance on experts. So she trains violent prisoners to be facilitators, leaders to be effective communicators, teenagers to be peer mediators and neighbours to be tenant listeners within their respective communities.
This Podcast has been brought to you by Disruptive Media. https://disruptivemedia.co.uk/
UK